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The question in reference to cleaning the water chamber comes up every other week it seems. All you have to do is do a search and you'll find many threads.

Many people say (the most knowledgeable among us) that they dumped the water and sanitized everything when they first started this therapy, but as time went by that came to an end. Now they just top off nightly and never bother ever cleaning the tank. I look to see if anything is actually in there but I've never seen anything but a clean tank. I always use distilled water and my only concern is to remember to check the water level before I go to sleep. So far, so good.

ems wrote:you go again Palerider...

there you go again, ems, butting your unwanted nose into someone elses conversation so you could be the busybody that you are.

what, do you think you're the president of the cpaptalk homeowners association? telling people what color they can paint their doors and whether their cars are pretty enough to park in their driveways?

why don't you (in your words) stop this nonsense and go play at your grandaughters school some more.

ems wrote:

palerider wrote:

fdw wrote:FYI,
Legionnaires' disease is transmitted by inhalation of aerosolized water and/or soil contaminated with the bacteria. It is not airborne and it is not transmitted from person-to-person.

so, what you're saying is that archangel's 'thought experiment' of getting legionnaires from a non sanitized cpap tank is, like most of his opinions presented as fact, dubious?

There you go again Palerider... you almost made it 24 hours before you said something in a way that was totally unnecessary and bound to cause a nasty come back.

I don't always agree with Archangel... but at least he doesn't put someone down in every other sentence.

I disagree with your "attack" on Palerider.
SOME people have a history of trying to connect dots that aren't connectable by innuendos and gross exaggerations. "Arch" was the one who brought up Legionnaires' disease in this thread. "fdw" was essentially quoting from the link I had provided (or one similar to it) regarding Legionella bacteria.

To stretch the imagination that the Legionella bacteria is potentially in every XPAP humidifier tank.......and it's going to grow into a "Blob", crawl up the hose and eat your face off is about as big of an exaggeration as I just made about the "Blob" (think of the 1955 movie with Steve McQueen).

I wish people would stick to the facts and reasonable logic in some of this stuff.

Den

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From the link I provided:


Legionella (Legionnaires' Disease and Pontiac Fever)

Causes & Transmission
On this Page

Legionella in the Environment

Legionnaires' disease (LEE-juh-nares) is caused by a type of bacteria called Legionella. The Legionella bacteria are found naturally in the environment, usually in water. The bacteria grow best in warm water, like the kind found in

Hot tubs
Cooling towers
Hot water tanks
Large plumbing systems
Decorative fountains

They do not seem to grow in car or window air-conditioners.

Spread of Disease

People get Legionnaires' disease when they breathe in a mist or vapor (small droplets of water in the air) containing the bacteria. One example might be from breathing in droplets sprayed from a hot tub that has not been properly cleaned and disinfected. The bacteria are not spread from one person to another person.

The bacteria are NOT spread from one person to another person.

Exposure

Most people exposed to the bacteria do not become ill. If you have reason to believe you were exposed to the bacteria, talk to your doctor or local health department. Be sure to mention if you have traveled in the last two weeks.

A person diagnosed with Legionnaires' disease in the workplace is not a threat to others who share office space or other areas with him or her. However, if you believe that your workplace was the source of the person's illness, contact your local health department.


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ems wrote:The question in reference to cleaning the water chamber comes up every other week it seems. All you have to do is do a search and you'll find many threads.

Many people say (the most knowledgeable among us) that they dumped the water and sanitized everything when they first started this therapy, but as time went by that came to an end. Now they just top off nightly and never bother ever cleaning the tank. I look to see if anything is actually in there but I've never seen anything but a clean tank. I always use distilled water and my only concern is to remember to check the water level before I go to sleep. So far, so good.

Me too!
Except on the first morning after I started, I dumped the water and thought "WHY did I do that?" It was still "clean" and seemed like a waste to throw it out. So, that's when I started topping off the tank.

But, I DO dump, rinse with hot water and refill with distilled when I start a new gallon of distilled. Just did that the day before yesterday.

Den

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Wulfman... wrote:I disagree with your "attack" on Palerider.
SOME people have a history of trying to connect dots that aren't connectable by innuendos and gross exaggerations. "Arch" was the one who brought up Legionnaires' disease in this thread. "fdw" was essentially quoting from the link I had provided (or one similar to it) regarding Legionella bacteria.

To stretch the imagination that the Legionella bacteria is potentially in every XPAP humidifier tank.......and it's going to grow into a "Blob", crawl up the hose and eat your face off is about as big of an exaggeration as I just made about the "Blob" (think of the 1955 movie with Steve McQueen).

I wish people would stick to the facts and reasonable logic in some of this stuff.

Den

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Den... exactly the same scenario... it was not what he said but the way in which it was said. He chooses to say things to deliberately cause someone to say something nasty right back. It's childish and unnecessary. Why attempt to make someone feel less than?? There is a way to disagree vehemently and not cause flame wars. And, every time he does I'm going to jump right in. No, I'm not a moderator, but I'm tired of it. For the most part we are adults here and are supposed to be able to ask questions, give opinions and/or pay it forward. Notice he made several comments that didn't incite in the last couple of days ... those I didn't respond to.

Now the person who recently said something about selling CPAP stuff on the forum, along with drugs... that is another story entirely. Person wasn't a known member and obviously, well, never mind... but you get my point I'm sure. Posts that tend to incite, especially to known members of this forum, help no one!

palerider wrote:

fdw wrote:FYI,
Legionnaires' disease is transmitted by inhalation of aerosolized water and/or soil contaminated with the bacteria. It is not airborne and it is not transmitted from person-to-person.

so, what you're saying is that archangel's 'thought experiment' of getting legionnaires from a non sanitized cpap tank is, like most of his opinions presented as fact, dubious?

You've got to change your meds, palerider, you're imagining things. I never said it happened. I pointed out that aerosolized water can spread many diseases. Legonnaire's disease is the most famous aerosolized water incident.

Some people are way too certain that germs in the water tank can't get out into the airstream. Presumably, the machines are designed to make this unlikely, but if you look at the surface of the water in the humidifier while using it, especially if you get a large leak, the surface is pretty stirred up and might produce some aerosol droplets.

I'm not terribly worried about it, but there is some risk, and it's a good reason to keep the water tank clean. Some people go for months without cleaning the tank. If you've got a science experiment going on in your tank, or if it's nasty when you clean it, you need to improve your cleaning process.

archangle wrote:

palerider wrote: so, what you're saying is that archangel's 'thought experiment' of getting legionnaires from a non sanitized cpap tank is, like most of his opinions presented as fact, dubious?

You've got to change your meds, palerider, you're imagining things. I never said it happened. I pointed out that aerosolized water can spread many diseases. Legonnaire's disease is the most famous aerosolized water incident.

perhaps I should get some of the stuff you're tripping on!

you bring up legionnaire's while talking about your 'theory' of aerosolized water from a cpap, after having set up a twisted scenario to make possible.... really, overfill and then leave the hose off hose off...

just how is legionella supposed to get into the tank in the first place, in your scare scenario?

perhaps if you'd stick to something approaching real life, then your speculations would be more believable. of course, if you labeled them as speculations, that too would help. there's nothing wrong with flights of fancy

what drugs are those of yours again?

Sorry, that's enough troll food for right now.

I empty my tank every few months, but I never see things in my water as long as I stick with distilled water. If I run out & have to use tap water a night or two, I definitely see things floating, so I dump & clean.

I know germs can grow in water, but if they were deadly, around my house everyone would be sick or dead. We have two very large fish tanks, a waterbed, a pool & hot tub. With all that standing water, I've never caught Legionnaires or any other nasty-like disease. That said, maybe I've just been lucky.

Jen

ps , I don't clean my mask or tubing as recommended either, I just clean them as needed, or if I've had a cold.

Realizing that the average pathogen is somewhat smaller than an average house fly or mosquito, looking into the tank and not seeing any "big chunks" may not be totally informative. If you want to know if anything is growing in your tank you need to take a sample of the water and have it cultured. If a bunch of "warm fuzzy" things grow then you will know a little bit about what is going on.

If all of that is too much work to do, keep your leaks at a minimum, empty your tank in the morning and let it dry out, and eat a balance diet to keep your immune working at top efficiency. If you already know that your immune system is working well don't do anything.

If you don't dump your water daily keep your pets and grandchildren away from your machine. I still remember the time my grandson figured out how to open things up, took a sip of the water from the humidifier tank, then spit it back into the tank. A couple of days later I was wondering how a chewed up kernel of corn made its way into my humidifier tank...

Let's assume that the water is changed daily and is sterile. Let's even assume that the tube is somehow sterile. Let me assure each of you that the last several inches of the humidified air passes through something that is not sterile by a long shot! Either your nose or your mouth or BOTH!

Every breath that you have ever taken passes through parts of your body that are full of bacteria, your mouth or nose, so I certainly wouldn't worry excessively about changing your water daily!

RobertS975 wrote:Let's assume that the water is changed daily and is sterile. Let's even assume that the tube is somehow sterile. Let me assure each of you that the last several inches of the humidified air passes through something that is not sterile by a long shot! Either your nose or your mouth or BOTH!

Every breath that you have ever taken passes through parts of your body that are full of bacteria, your mouth or nose, so I certainly wouldn't worry excessively about changing your water daily!

There's some truth in that. However, sometimes there is strength in numbers.

If you inhale a few dozen individual germs of bacteria X each day, your body may fight it off every time. However, if the bacteria multiplies somewhere and you're now inhaling 10,000 every day, it might manage to get past your initial defenses.

As I've said, I'm not that fanatical about cleaning my water tank and CPAP equipment, but I do believe there is some risk and you shouldn't completely ignore the risks of dirty equipment.