Resmed Airsense 10 Autoset vs Aircurve 10 VAuto

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
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Pugsy
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Re: Resmed Airsense 10 Autoset vs Aircurve 10 VAuto

Post by Pugsy » Tue Jun 21, 2022 12:29 pm

Unfortunately what I don't have is a crystal ball to see what pressures someone may or may not need in the future.
I lost some weight a few years back and actually found that I needed a bit less pressure overall....but I also have read about people losing weight and ending up needing more pressure. Go figure that one but I have seen it reported here more than just a handful of times
Likewise while we assuming that a weight increase might cause the need for more pressure...it is possible but not always a certainty.

Do airway tissues continue to worsen in terms of patency so that more pressure might be needed as we age?????
It's a possibility but again no certainty. I have been on cpap 13 years now and I just celebrated my 70th birthday last month and with the exception of a minor reduction in pressure needs which I attribute to the 20 lb weight loss...there really hasn't been a marked change either way. I still sometimes need pressures in the mid teens during REM (where my OSA is documented much more severe) but it does seem to happen less frequently.
What would have happened if the weight change had gone up and not down? I don't know but it wouldn't have surprised me if I gained that 20 pounds and started seeing pressures trend higher.

You may not technically "need" the additional features that the AirCurve 10 VAuto offers at this point....but there is simply no way to know if you will NEVER need/want those features or not. When someone can come up with a good working accurate crystal ball this cpap therapy would be so much easier. :lol:

How much time do you have before you lose the chance of making the easy decision to go to the bilevel device?

I tend to always adopt the "it's better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it" approach to just about everything....but that is me and how I look at life. There are people who would kill to be in your shoes because they drastically want/need the bilevel machine for any number of reasons and can't get it.
I think I would still advise getting the bilevel because there's really nothing that you can't do with it when compared to the AutoSet in terms of settings and mimicking the AutoSet settings. It can easily be "dumbed down" to function exactly like the AutoSet functions if that's what a person wants BUT if their wants/needs change sometime in the future then it can easily be changed. It's not always so easy to change models in the future as in go buy/get a different model machine.
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Pugsy
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Re: Resmed Airsense 10 Autoset vs Aircurve 10 VAuto

Post by Pugsy » Tue Jun 21, 2022 12:43 pm

TheSeaOtter wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 12:20 pm
My Airsense isn't showing RERA data on OSCAR. Does it even matter? My previuos Philips System One ReMaster showed a lot more info than the Airsense for some reason.
Am I missing any way to get more data out of the Airsense?
The Respironics machines showed FLs in terms of a flagged event....the ResMed devices show FLs in terms of a graph.
Both show FL data but they show it in a different manner. Pros and cons to either way IMHO.

RERA data being absent....doesn't matter if you never had much RERA data in the first place and if you did it should have been dealt with.
I wasn't aware the bilevel didn't flag RERAs... :lol: :lol: I thought the reason was because I never had any.
But then when I used the AutoSet for Her AirSense 10 model I never had RERAs flagged with it either...and it does flagged RERAs...I just didn't ever have any.

The Respironics machines have a slightly different set of criteria for flagging of anything than ResMed brand machines.
Very minor differences in criteria needed to meet the flagging criteria...plus the overall auto adjusting algorithm between the 2 brands is different. Typically Respironics reports showed a little more flagging of events when compared to same pressure settings to the ResMed reports. Mainly because the response time was longer with Respironics algorithms and it was just a little slower to respond to the airway collapsing or trying to collapse...so greater chance for something to get flagged in the first place. I started cpap on a Respironics auto adjusting device...2 years in fact before I tried a ResMed device. I found that I could get better results with the ResMed at the same pressures than I got with the Respironics.
I ended up reducing the pressures just a little bit to get essentially the results I got with the Respironics.

So you really aren't missing much in terms of data available....it's just getting reported a little differently (those FLs) and maybe if you aren't seeing much flagging going on now then the machine is doing a better job preventing things from happening due to a more responsive algorithm.

Old video that compares the algorithms but the AirSense 10 and the S9 algorithms are the same.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzCCgNLya_g
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palerider
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Re: Resmed Airsense 10 Autoset vs Aircurve 10 VAuto

Post by palerider » Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:16 pm

TheSeaOtter wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 11:25 am
But the Aircurve 10 VAuto cannot be run with EPR disabled, can it? That's how I'm using my Airsense currently, Pressure from 4-20; EPR disabled.
The Aircuve 10 VAuto does not have EPR

EPR is a limited, reverse PS. Where EPR is a pressure drop, PS is a pressure rise.

The VAuto has PS that can be set between 0 and 22.

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palerider
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Re: Resmed Airsense 10 Autoset vs Aircurve 10 VAuto

Post by palerider » Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:23 pm

TheSeaOtter wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 12:20 pm
My Airsense isn't showing RERA data on OSCAR. Does it even matter? My previuos Philips System One ReMaster showed a lot more info than the Airsense for some reason.
Oh, it had more rows of little tick marks, but the Resmed machines shore more info.

for instance, instead of just a tick mark that says "flow limitation" resmed gives you a chart, showing you how *bad* the FLs are, same with snoring, so that's three rows of tick marks that are gone.

If the Resmed senses what it thinks is a RERA, it'll show you a flag for it, until there's flags, Oscar won't show the strip for them.

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Get OSCAR and come chat on IRC: #cpaptalk on irc.libera.chat

Accounts to put on the foe list: dataq1, gearchange, mper!?, DreamDiver, Geer1, almostadoctor, sleepgeek, ajack, stom, mogy, D.H., They're often post misleading, timewasting stuff.

TheSeaOtter
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Re: Resmed Airsense 10 Autoset vs Aircurve 10 VAuto

Post by TheSeaOtter » Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:23 pm

Pugsy wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 12:29 pm
Unfortunately what I don't have is a crystal ball to see what pressures someone may or may not need in the future.
I lost some weight a few years back and actually found that I needed a bit less pressure overall....but I also have read about people losing weight and ending up needing more pressure. Go figure that one but I have seen it reported here more than just a handful of times
Likewise while we assuming that a weight increase might cause the need for more pressure...it is possible but not always a certainty.

Do airway tissues continue to worsen in terms of patency so that more pressure might be needed as we age?????
It's a possibility but again no certainty. I have been on cpap 13 years now and I just celebrated my 70th birthday last month and with the exception of a minor reduction in pressure needs which I attribute to the 20 lb weight loss...there really hasn't been a marked change either way. I still sometimes need pressures in the mid teens during REM (where my OSA is documented much more severe) but it does seem to happen less frequently.
What would have happened if the weight change had gone up and not down? I don't know but it wouldn't have surprised me if I gained that 20 pounds and started seeing pressures trend higher.

You may not technically "need" the additional features that the AirCurve 10 VAuto offers at this point....but there is simply no way to know if you will NEVER need/want those features or not. When someone can come up with a good working accurate crystal ball this cpap therapy would be so much easier. :lol:

How much time do you have before you lose the chance of making the easy decision to go to the bilevel device?

I tend to always adopt the "it's better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it" approach to just about everything....but that is me and how I look at life. There are people who would kill to be in your shoes because they drastically want/need the bilevel machine for any number of reasons and can't get it.
I think I would still advise getting the bilevel because there's really nothing that you can't do with it when compared to the AutoSet in terms of settings and mimicking the AutoSet settings. It can easily be "dumbed down" to function exactly like the AutoSet functions if that's what a person wants BUT if their wants/needs change sometime in the future then it can easily be changed. It's not always so easy to change models in the future as in go buy/get a different model machine.
Hello Pugsy! Sorry for the delayed response. Was pretty packed up last few days so couldn't reply. And, Belated Happy Birthday to You!!!!
I get it, I should have taken the VAuto. But turns out, the free return policy was only if I hadn't used the machine. Couldn't risk not getting the refund and losing the device.
So basically I ended up sticking with the the AutoSet.

I've been collecting data. Have been having a very varied response. Seems like the decision of getting the AutoSet instead of VAuto was wrong in the first place as I was depending on a risky return and refund policy. My pressures sometimes reach 20, looks like it is not being enough.

I'll be posting this screenshot data in a new post. Please can you check the out and help me optimize?
Pugsy wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 12:43 pm
machine is doing a better job preventing things from happening due to a more responsive algorithm.

Old video that compares the algorithms but the AirSense 10 and the S9 algorithms are the same.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzCCgNLya_g
Amazing video. I get how the algorithm works now. Thanks!

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TheSeaOtter
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Re: Resmed Airsense 10 Autoset vs Aircurve 10 VAuto

Post by TheSeaOtter » Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:30 pm

palerider wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:16 pm
TheSeaOtter wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 11:25 am
But the Aircurve 10 VAuto cannot be run with EPR disabled, can it? That's how I'm using my Airsense currently, Pressure from 4-20; EPR disabled.
The Aircuve 10 VAuto does not have EPR

EPR is a limited, reverse PS. Where EPR is a pressure drop, PS is a pressure rise.

The VAuto has PS that can be set between 0 and 22.
Sadly, I couldn't go for the the return and getting the VAuto. So I ended up sticking with the VAuto. Bad decision to get the Autoset in the first place. Had I found this forum before the purchase I'd be so luck. My technician didn't know if the VAuto can be dumbed down to the AutoSet and now I've to stick with the AutoSet.
palerider wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:23 pm
TheSeaOtter wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 12:20 pm
My Airsense isn't showing RERA data on OSCAR. Does it even matter? My previuos Philips System One ReMaster showed a lot more info than the Airsense for some reason.
Oh, it had more rows of little tick marks, but the Resmed machines shore more info.

for instance, instead of just a tick mark that says "flow limitation" resmed gives you a chart, showing you how *bad* the FLs are, same with snoring, so that's three rows of tick marks that are gone.

If the Resmed senses what it thinks is a RERA, it'll show you a flag for it, until there's flags, Oscar won't show the strip for them.
Thanks! You guys have been very helpful with my doubts.
I started to have varied data with different setting. I'll be posting the screenshots in a new post. Can you guys help me optimize it?

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