Does excercise worsen central apneas?

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
sleepinow
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Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by sleepinow » Wed Oct 02, 2013 10:58 pm

Hi I was wondering if me lifting weights can alter the way I normally breathe therefore change the way I am supposed to breathe when using my ASV. During excercise I breathe harder and differently. I feel that throughout the day my breathing seems off. What I mean when I say off is that my breathing pattern seems to change.

Does the ASV unit change the way you normally breathe after a while of use? I feel like I sleep worse when excercising. I do not run because I am very slowly recovering from an injury in my foot. (I prefer running to lifting) So can lifting weights change the way you breathe and in effect worsen apnea occurrences?

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Captain_Midnight
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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by Captain_Midnight » Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:19 am

Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Unlikely, I suspect.

I run 2 to 3 x/week, and lift 3 to 4 x/week, with almost nothing in the way of centrals to report.

(AHI is 0.3, and CAs as they are called on my PR-1 are rare events with me.)

I'm not a doc, but I do recommend exercise for almost everyone (although many will need a doc's clearance and guidance, first).

Hope your injury improves, and you are back on the running trail soon.


.

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Julie
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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by Julie » Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:24 am

He wasn't asking if centrals are caused by OSA, but if they worsen with Cpap if you already have them and exercise.

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Captain_Midnight
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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by Captain_Midnight » Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:55 am

He wasn't asking if centrals are caused by OSA, but if they worsen with Cpap if you already have them and exercise.

?

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jamiswolf
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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by jamiswolf » Thu Oct 03, 2013 12:15 pm

Hi Sleepinow,
Odd things can happen within the human body. As an unrelated example, respiratory drive can shift from CO2 levels to O2 levels in COPD patients.

Regarding weight lifting, it's very important to breathe properly during lifting. Never hold your breath. And I'd also wonder if having thick chest muscles is a good goal in someone with any form of sleep apnea. It seems that it could be restrictive in the same way a layer of fat is. There is a relationship between serious body builders and OSA though not necessarily centrals. Plenty of info on the web.


Couldn't you find some form of cardio workout that would satisfy your exercise needs? Rowing machine for example. Just some thoughts...
J

Connectplus1
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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by Connectplus1 » Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:12 pm

Central apneas could be caused by neurological, heart, etc problems. Which to some degree tie in with excercise. Check with your doctor. If you have Central apnea, you may need ASV/VPap machine for best results.

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chunkyfrog
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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by chunkyfrog » Thu Oct 03, 2013 3:15 pm

Lifting weights to what extent?
Competitive body-building involves extremes that may not be the best for your body;
but, IMO, moderate strength building seems to be pretty much a good thing overall.
If centrals are significant, you may need to get your doctor to try you on a machine designed for that.

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SeekSleep
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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by SeekSleep » Thu Oct 03, 2013 7:04 pm

My thought process based on a relatively short period of time, and a sample size of just little old me would indicate the answer is no.

My history though the years was to exercise rather heavily, at a competitive level for many years. Unfortunately, life was such the last 3 or 4 years to where I wasn't exercising as much as I should have. When I went on my Bipap, I got a boost of energy, and daily workouts became the norm again, both aerobic and weight training. During the 4 months I was on a Bipap, my central apneas stayed pretty consistent. Since I've been on the ASV machine I can't say how things are going really as my machine doesn't record CA's, and even if it did I have so few apneas now that they really don't mean anything.

The above said, I have learned over the years that should I over train with weights, it tends to kick up my resting respiration and heart rate more, and for longer periods of time than I experience when I over train with aerobic exercise such as running, or biking. It makes sense to me that if I change those things it could have an effect on apnea, I just haven't seen any evidence of it in myself. The machines do make is possible though to see hard data on your respiration rate which may be of use in tailoring a training program.

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sleepinow
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Re: Does excercise worsen therapy with ASV units?

Post by sleepinow » Fri Oct 04, 2013 3:09 am

Okay maybe I worded this a bit wrong. I should have replaced centrals apneas in the title to therapy with ASV. Okay after exercise of about an hour at the gym it feels as though my breathing pattern change making me uncomfortable with sleeping with my ASV. Meaning that I twitch as if it was me getting used to the machine all over again. I also feel more tired the next day. Wouldn't it seem that adjustment in regular breathing can alter therapy because the machine has its own way of breathing for you. The ASV obviously does not fully adjust to your way of breathing so if my breathing pattern is slightly different from what the ASV is operating at, wouldn't that make me have to readjust my way of breathing with the machine?

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jamiswolf
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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by jamiswolf » Fri Oct 04, 2013 8:57 am

As users of the ASV type machine have reported, it's as much you training yourself to the machine as it is the machine adjusting to your breathing.

If you "get along" with your machine on non-weight lifting days and this difficulty only occurs on those days when you weight lift. Well then it seems you've answered your own question.

And it's your decision as to whether it's worth it. Simple as that.
Jamis

PS: I just had an idea...might you be doing something else differently on those exercise days? Diet or drug related? I'm thinking more caffeine or an energy drink or two? Something that might effect your breathing other then the exercise itself. Just a thought...
Last edited by jamiswolf on Fri Oct 04, 2013 9:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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andy5805
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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by andy5805 » Fri Oct 04, 2013 9:21 am

I'm not on a machine yet but soon to be on one

I lift weights, and do cardio

of the two, cardio 9 times out of 10 has a wonderful effect on my sleep. It seems the harder I push my breathing, the better it works when I'm asleep. Weights usually also provide moderate improvement

the big thing for me is getting it right when I do my arms. This is crucial because if I get it wrong or overtrain, they stiffen up too much and I end up sleeping on my back. Back sleeping for me (and a lot of people) makes OSA far worse. So I'll do my arms on a day like today or sat, I know I am more relaxed as there's no work the next day. Worse case, I can stay in bed a little. Whereas if I do my arms weekdays it's a bad idea.

This messes with my split routine because ideally I want to do my chest shoulders triceps another day to my biceps/back. This is potentially two bad nights because of the split routine so I've had to give in some weekends and get tri/bi/shoulders into one night but as long as you mix up the routine you can get good gains. If I must split the conventional way, then I find combination of triceps/shoulder most likely to put me on my back, and thus give me a worse night sleep.

But cardio is king. Cannot praise it highly enough.

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sleepinow
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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by sleepinow » Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:58 am

Thanks for the reply. I am well adjusted to the machine and am aware of its basic functions, however, it seems when I work out, weights not cardio, it disrupts my sleeping. And my diet is really really good. I am going to do a few more tests on myself with this matter but it would be really bad for me if I am not able to work out. (I am trying to become a police officer)

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Max EPAP: 25.0
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Max Pressure: 20.0
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Julie
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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by Julie » Fri Oct 04, 2013 12:37 pm

It's often been advised, especially for people with insomnia, to not workout directly before bedtime, so you might want to change your sched. and see if it helps.

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ChicagoGranny
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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by ChicagoGranny » Fri Oct 04, 2013 4:17 pm

sleepinow wrote: it seems when I work out, weights not cardio, it disrupts my sleeping.
You have yet to mention how much time there is between your workouts and bedtime. This could be the biggest factor.

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Re: Does excercise worsen central apneas?

Post by Sir NoddinOff » Fri Oct 04, 2013 5:02 pm

If I overdo exercise, mostly mountain biking or hiking, on any given day (and I mean really overdo it), then that night my brain, heart and diaphragm don't really seem to coordinate very well. I can usually get adequate sleep but my periods of REM seem to usually elevate to the AWAKE STAGE (shown below) instead of stage one or two where they are supposed to be. I can't really explain it, but if I keep within my window of exercise tolerance when out on the trails then I don't seem to have many problems that night.
Image

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