Training to NOT mouth breathe

Hawthorne · Post by **Hawthorne** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:32 pm

A few people on this forum have mentioned that they trained themsleves not to mouth breathe. How did you do this? I did not mouth breathe until sometime last fall ( after 5 years on cpap!) In the last month I have been using a saline nasal spray about an hour before bedtime and using a cotton swab to put some nasal gel into my nostrils right at bedtime. I don't mind any of this but I do not like the taping! I get by with very little tape (2 one inch strips placed vertically). I keep my mouth open a crack. My AHI is really good right now (4 out of the last 5 nights it was 0.something). I WOULD LIKE to stop taping! I have a Hybrid which I like but am still adapting it and have not tried it for a full night yet.
How can I train myself to not mouth breathe?

hobbs · Post by **hobbs** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:39 pm

I was a mouth breather for probably 50+ years. I got my 1st CPAP a little over 5 years ago. The tip I was given, and it eventually worked, was to place your tongue on the roof of your mouth like you were saying the letter "T" as you fall asleep. It took a few weeks, but it worked.

goose · Post by **goose** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:04 pm

As hobbs said, putting your tongue at the roof of the mouth closes off the path.

I worked at it for about 2 months before I got my machine and now I breathe through my nose all the time (unless like today, allergies attack -- though presently I'm using my nose - better living through chemistry ).

During "training" every time I caught myself breathing through my mouth, I consciously corrected myself and concentrated on nose breathing for at least 15 minutes each time I caught it.....eventually I didn't use my mouth at all....

The secret is the tongue at the top of the mouth all the time.
Good luck
cheers
goose

Country4ever · Post by **Country4ever** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:45 pm

I sometimes think its a subconscious thing. What I mean is, I think I have become my own "guard" at night, somehow, and make myself keep my mouth closed. Unfortunately, I think it doesn't work in the deepest stages of sleep for me.
I seem to do well for several weeks, then I need to retrain myself, by wearing a chinstrap or taping (which I hate also.....and it really causes my sinuses to burn).
Try making sure your tongue is where others have suggested you put it, and that your jaw is closed, every time you go to sleep/wake up during the night. It might take some practice.

sleepngo · Post by **sleepngo** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:48 pm

I was able to control my mouth leaking with the tongue in the roof routine and by using a Liberty full face mask. At first I tried using the mask as intended, but still found myself breathing through my mouth into the mask. I modified the mask by applying a piece of Saran warp to the mouth piece, thereby preventing my breathing into the mask, also preventing me from mouth leaking. I did this for about a week, then went back to using my nasal mask and it worked. I now use a OptiLife nasal pillows mask and a Soyala nasal mask and only on rare occasions, like now, because of allergy season, I breath through my mouth, I keep it under control with the nasal rinses and Ary gel.

You might try applying the same technique with your Hybrid mask.

Dan

birdshell · Post by **birdshell** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:05 pm

sleepngo wrote:...<snip>
I modified the mask by applying a piece of Saran warp to the mouth piece, thereby preventing my breathing into the mask, also preventing me from mouth leaking.
<snip>

In this case, I suggest that one should be sure to NOT block the exhaust ports/holes in the mask.

Still, quite an inventive idea and I may be trying that tonight....

Yours for free and clear nasal passages,

Karen

DreamStalker · Post by **DreamStalker** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:28 pm

I think effective control of "mouth leaking" has more to do with strengthening the soft palate. Parking the tongue up on the roof of the mouth (underside of soft palate) helps support the soft palate to direct the airflow from the sinuses into the throat and to the lungs.

I too first began training myself not to mouth leak by maintaining the tongue up on the roof of the mouth. I then realized that I could control the airflow without placing my tongue on the roof of my mouth. That’s when I did a little Google research and discovered that we do indeed have muscle tissue within the soft palate and that singers often exercise it to strengthen it in order to master singing techniques.

So I can now put my nasal pillow mask on under pressure and open my mouth and breathe through the mask without mouth leaking. I guess I’m weird that way ... but I still can't sing worth a crap so I guess I won't be on American Idol

Hehe ... but I don't have to mess with chinstraps or tape or glue or staples or bolts and such

6PtStar · Post by **6PtStar** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:11 pm

DreamStalker wrote: I guess I’m weird that way ...

Must be the neighborhood "take US183 and make a left when you pass the dead skunk on the road". I think I know just where that is!!

I think a lot of us would like to be like that!

Jerry

Hawthorne · Post by **Hawthorne** » Thu Apr 24, 2008 8:09 am

Dreamstalker- I can't sing "worth a crap" either!!! But -- -do you know sites I could go to and find those exercises so that I might be able to stop mouth breathing? I could google but thought you might remember some of the better sites. I will not presume that, after all these years, I MIGHT really be a great singer after all!!! Which raises another question in my strange mind --- do great singers ever get sleep apnea or are they saved by these exercises?????
Thanks!

ozij · Post by **ozij** » Thu Apr 24, 2008 8:18 am

Kurtchan

O.

Issac · Post by **Issac** » Thu Apr 24, 2008 8:47 am

Birdshell pecked the nail right on the head.

Do not ever block off your exhalation ports. You could begin rebreathing your CO2 and than suffer brain damage.

There are many pillow and prong offerings sold that accompanied with a little tape for the mouth will work fine, so long as your pressure needs are not in the tornado zone (like mine).

If your pressure goes above 16, get a full face mask or a dual face mask, as anythng else will probably blow right off your face.

DreamStalker · Post by **DreamStalker** » Thu Apr 24, 2008 9:05 am

Hawthorne wrote:Dreamstalker- I can't sing "worth a crap" either!!! But -- -do you know sites I could go to and find those exercises so that I might be able to stop mouth breathing? I could google but thought you might remember some of the better sites. I will not presume that, after all these years, I MIGHT really be a great singer after all!!! Which raises another question in my strange mind --- do great singers ever get sleep apnea or are they saved by these exercises?????
Thanks!

Well, I never did any of the exercises cuz by the time I began investigating muscle tissue in the soft palate, I had already strengthened my soft palate muscles to the point of not having to need to use my tongue for support or exercises for my soft palate (maybe that's why I still can't sing ... oh well).

Here is a Google search link -

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=so ... gle+Search

I think common OSA is influenced more by the tongue falling into a narrow throat opening than the strength of the soft palate ... so I don't think singers are exempt from having OSA ... but what do I know, I'm just one of those weird guys

rested gal · Post by **rested gal** » Thu Apr 24, 2008 9:22 am

I think nasal pillows masks can work fine at very high pressures -- even at 20.

Ted (Titrator) used a Breeze with nasal pillows just fine for several years, at pressure of 18.

I've tried out several nasal pillows experimentally at pressures of 19 and 20, just to see if they could seal ok up there in the stratosphere. They did. I always have to use a homemade strap (the leg cut off a pair of tights) to steady nasal pillows at any pressure, even very low pressures. So, I was using the homemade strap during my high pressure experiments.

The stabilizing "extra strap" cradling the nasal pillows like a sling under and around them keeps them in place fine, even for toss 'n turn sleeping at high pressures. Having the main air hose rigged to hang up out of the way overhead is important too, imho. Keeps the weight of the air hose from tugging at any mask when a person turns over.

Aeiomed's Headrest
Puritan Bennett's Breeze
Respironics ComfortLite 2

Those masks' nasal pillows can definitely seal fine at high pressures. With that good old "extra strap" around 'em, anyway.

birdshell · Post by **birdshell** » Thu Apr 24, 2008 10:48 am

Yes, GOOD singers do have apnea. SOME are even on this forum! For one thing, many singers are overweight--which we all know can contribute to apnea.

I happen to know some wonderful singers who have apnea. If only, in my competitive singing days, I'd had my cpap just for the HUMIDITY in the dry hotel rooms where we stayed during competitions. <sigh>

Ah, well...any other singers out there who care to come forward?

Karen

ozij · Post by **ozij** » Thu Apr 24, 2008 10:52 am

...And they also have mouthleaks, as I remember from Kurtchan's posts.

O.

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Training to NOT mouth breathe

Training to NOT mouth breathe

Training to NOT mouth breathe

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