OT: Hotsauce: Abuse or Punishment?

[BlackSpinner]

I agree with Jabman. I believe that the "spare the rod" scripture is misunderstood. When they talk about "the rod" in the scriptures, they are talking about the "shepherd's rod," right? So did the shepherds beat their sheep with the rod? No, they did not, they guided the sheep with the rod. Just my interpretation, that makes more sense when you think about what they are referring to in that age and time period. Just my two cents.

Lori "QF" Dawn

Maybe but unfortunately my ex (in child protection) had to deal with this group of religious parents who felt that it meant that their two year olds (and up) had to be regularly beaten with a stick or they would be spoiled and the devil would take them over. So I am not the only one who thinks of the quotation that way.

[ameriken]

Maybe but unfortunately my ex (in child protection) had to deal with this group of religious parents who felt that it meant that their two year olds (and up) had to be regularly beaten with a stick or they would be spoiled and the devil would take them over. So I am not the only one who thinks of the quotation that way.

It's funny how people use the extreme and rare examples to make their judgments about something.

The quote doesn't say to be abusive. It would be like saying cars are bad and no one should drive them because some mothers have driven their cars into the lake with their kids in them.

[Lori Dawn]

Yes, I understand that it is a widely held belief that the Bible endorses using a "rod" to "beat" our children, and that has been an accepted way of disciplining children because "it's in the Bible." I was just pointing out a different interpretation based on the words in the Bible and the way those words were used in order to be understandable to the people of the time. I do not believe that a loving God would want us to beat or abuse our children. I also think that spankings can be used as guidance when done in a non-violent way.

I was just pointing out that there is another interpretation to the "spare the rod" quotation in the Bible, and that it does not give someone license to abuse their children in the name of the Bible.

That was all I was trying to say. I know that my way of looking at that passage is not a widely held interpretation.

[RandyJ]

Hot sauce, corporal punishment & the like are a refuge for the intellectually challenged.

[CPAP Lady]

I think hot sauce, soap, and spanking are really unnecessary. I think other methods such as time outs and taking away privileges can be just as effective. I also think that just because a parent does not spank does not mean they are lax parents. I think one can set rules/expectations/limits quite effectively without resorting to inflicting physical pain IMHO. I agree that there are a lot of parents who do not parent their kids and try to be their best friends instead OTOH I think there are many who choose not to inflict physical pain and still run a tight ship so to speak .

I, for the most part, agree with you. And I only spanked my kids as a last resort, when non of the other things like taking privileges away did not work. I don't think there is anything wrong with giving your child a swat on the butt to let them know you mean business. Now I'm not talking about beating them on the but tell there black and blue but just one maybe two swats.
But if you can and have raised your kids without having to spank them then that is great, I would of preferd not to and only used as a last resort.

I agree that a swat or two with an open hand is not abuse. I do think it is definitely not preferable. I did that myself less than one handful of times when ds was younger and I regretted it every time:(. I think really I did not have to resort to that at all and was only frustrated at the those times and repeating what I learned as a child (and my parents did the same only a handful of times). I think with an expanded tool box of ideas parents do not need to spank at all.

[Uncle_Bob]

Maybe they should adopt a child themselves and see what its like to walk in this mothers shoes. Adoptive children can be very difficult.
IMO they found this mother guilty of child neglect when all she was doing was her job as parent.

I have quite a few children that Almighty God has blessed me with. Several are adopted.
I could not have been blessed any better than what I've been given. I love all my children equally.
I couldn't imagine torturing a child on an emotional level by punishing them like that, in this regard.
I think people who do this don't like themselves very much, and are in need of serious counseling.

I think if a god has to be imposed on us all in such a perfect and condescending way then surely children would not have be forced into sucking on some other kind of hot sauce in order to (in a way you say you can't imagine ??? wake up) satisfy the catholic priests at church?

I love my children, having said that I love all children. They are are future, keep them safe, don't count on god.

[chunkyfrog]

Children and other small creatures respond best to kindness, hear best the softest voice.
It is no accident. Animal trainers and teachers know these secrets.
When we shout and strike; we have lost a battle that need never have started.

[Vader]

I think if a god has to be imposed on us all in such a perfect and condescending way then surely children would not have be forced into sucking on some other kind of hot sauce in order to (in a way you say you can't imagine ??? wake up) satisfy the catholic priests at church?

I love my children, having said that I love all children. They are are future, keep them safe, don't count on god.

Oh He isn't "a" god, HE is GOD, he is "THE" GOD of all creation.
And I DO trust in HIM, totally. And He has brought me more happiness than I can describe. But this won't happen for you UNTIL you (figuratively) trust in Him. I know from my own experience that this is true!
God DOES love you, my friend. That's a fact.




edit: added the word "figuratively", for clarification purposes.

[Uncle_Bob]

I think if a god has to be imposed on us all in such a perfect and condescending way then surely children would not have be forced into sucking on some other kind of hot sauce in order to (in a way you say you can't imagine ??? wake up) satisfy the catholic priests at church?

I love my children, having said that I love all children. They are are future, keep them safe, don't count on god.

Oh He isn't "a" god, HE is GOD, he is "THE" GOD of all creation.
And I DO trust in HIM, totally. And He has brought me more happiness than I can describe. But this won't happen for you UNTIL you trust in Him. I know from my own experience that this is true!
God DOES love you, my friend. That's a fact.

I didn't say god was a he. Mind you I've never met him. But could he be she? I see nothing.
I am glad you are happy in life. I am also experiencing amazing happiness in life with my wife, children, family and friends.
I do not appreciate being told that a certain happiness won't happen until i believe in what you say i must believe in.

[Vader]

I didn't say<SNIPPED for brevity>...

I don't know how someone couldn't appreciate someone wanting to see them have eternal life, but no problem.
My job is done here. But I still do wish the best for you. Anger towards me is wasted, because it's not *me* whom you offend.

God Bless you and your family!

[mars]

Hi Everybody

I have met very few people who do not think they know all they need to know about "parenting", this belief is usually based on their own experience, and how they consider themselves to have "turned out" (usually good).

It is similar to crime, addiction, anti-social behaviour etc; most people think they have the answers, if not from their own experience, then from some "authority" that they chose to take as being right.

It follows from this that debate, facts, arguement etc are pointless in such discussions.

So I will not join in, but simply refer to a woman who has looked into child abuse a bit more than most of us have.

http://www.alice-miller.com/articles_en.php

Mars

[Bons]

Lori,
Rods were used by shepherds to examine the sheep to look for any injury or impairment and attend to it, as the sheep passed under the rod as it entered the fold. So discipline in that sense is to find a problem and address it in a healing, helpful way.
Rods were also used to guide and protect, to restrain from the sheep from going somewhere harmful.
Christians who are not conservative belief that the rod references to discipline mean disciplining our children like a shepherd disciplined the sheep - gentle guidance, gentle but effective reprimand.
A shepherd certainly would not hurt his own sheep.

Perhaps the worst offense this horrible mother did was to USE her child in order to get her 30 seconds of fame by appearing on a television show.... she wasn't disciplining him she was showing total lack of regard for him so that she could get what she wanted.

[Gerald?]

Must be the week for it, is this abuse or a parent trying to find a solution...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... other.html

[Julie]

Why didn't the parents instead find out what made the boy steal anything (if he did it) - why he had problems to begin with, though it seems pretty obvious to me...

[kteague]

One goal of parenting is to deliver a child into adulthood prepared for their life to come. Sadly, much discipline and/or punishment abandons that long range goal in exchange for the immediate gratification of forcing a profession of regret or proving who is boss. Not to defend or condemn mouth washing for kids with dirty mouths, but at least I can follow that logic a bit. In retrospect I would do so many things differently if I could get a do-over. Remember parents saying before a spanking, "This is going to hurt me more than it's going to hurt you."? And it truely did, as sometimes the parent would be in tears before the child. I just can't see that being the mindset of a parent while hot-saucing their child's mouth, or during some other popular forms of punishment. I think that the necessity of discipline should grieve a parent's heart. Otherwise it becomes about the emotions the parent has attached to the infraction, not about the child's learning experience. Indeed I do wish I could get a do-over on this one.