Can a Hiatus Hernia be caused by years of high pap pressure?

[sleepinglass]

Oh Pugsy I see, must have just been gagging too much!.

Chunky frog I am seriously thinking of going to the emergency room. I am just waiting for it to get worst first, as my doc said not to go. Also worried as my tummy feels very swollen and the swelling seems to be increasing as my trousers are getting tighter and tighter since that awful day! Could my abdomen be filling up with blood??

Or am I just having hysterical thoughts!!!!!

[NightMonkey]

20cm/h2o (<.25 psi) is not real high pressure and wouldn't have caused it and wouldn't be over-inflating your stomach.

To say that CPAP pressure is "not real high" means nothing without context. If you are comparing it to underwater diving you are correct. The deep end of the pool I use is 18 feet. I can dive down to the drain to retrieve an item and fairly easily exhale (partially) at the bottom. My lungs are exhaling against a pressure of 550 cm. Compare this to 20 cm and CPAP pressure seems small.


However, I am not sure what you mean by "over-inflating". CPAP pressure can definitely inflate the stomach and cause difficulty sleeping.

you're swallowing air for whatever reason.

This is not necessarily true. The most common cause for CPAP-induced aerophagia is air leaking through a weak lower esophogeal sphincter (LES).

It is true that some people may be anxious about the CPAP process, breathe nervously and swallow air in the process. This problem will disappear when the person learns to relax with the process. But a weak LES is unlikely to improve.

[LSAT]

Go to the emergency room. now.
This quack would rather see you die then let anyone know he SCREWED UP!

I tend to agree. Having this procedure done in your street clothes without sedation ? Who knows if the instruments were ever sterile. Where in the heck did you have this done...some 3rd world country?

[avi123]

It's gone!

[Pugsy]

Comment,

Pugsy, IMO, you're posting answers that are not true. You don't need to post about medical issues that you don't know about. Sleepingglass might be sick and need to be checked by either an internist or a GI physician. All the advice that you give about pressures, machine setting etc., DO NOT APPLY FOR A SICK PERSON WHO MIGHT HAVE A TERMINAL CASE, IF NOT TREATED IMMEDIATLY.

Avi....I never told her not to seek medical care...didn't think I needed to repeat what others had already said. I see no need to keep posting a suggestion that has been made by several people. Since I didn't say it doesn't mean I don't think she should have it checked out though. I figured she is an adult and the suggestion was made and it was up to her to act on it or not.
I only mentioned that a biopsy might have caused some internal pain but I would think that it would be gone after this length of time (I am thinking the procedure was done a couple of weeks ago but I may have missed that part). I have had a colon biopsy and I was told that there might be some residual abdominal discomfort that might last a couple of days. Biopsies do mean some cutting...cutting causes pain of some sort and for some people more than others.

In regards to sleepinglass....she has been self treating long before I ever knew what a cpap machine was. She is a veteran cpap user from many years back. She has done things on her own without my thoughts or input ideas on changing anything. I didn't talk her into anything that she has done herself long before I came to know her.

I wasn't the person who brought up "terminal"...why do that? My comments were my general thoughts..I didn't tell her one way or the other what to do or what it was...only possible ideas. She knows full well that forum ideas or thoughts are nothing more than that and not to be used to avoid proper medical care. Just tossing out ideas that might explain the discomfort she is having. I certainly never told her NOT to have things checked out. In fact...looking back on my comments I think that I made it perfectly clear that I was just offering ideas. Didn't tell her to do anything or change anything. One thought about the max pressure maybe aggravating things was clearly offered as a thought only.

So I don't see where I might be "practicing medicine" at all here in this thread. I didn't say that she had GERD...only that someone can have it without normal symptoms. Tossing out ideas is a long way from telling someone what to do or making a diagnosis over the internet. I didn't tell her not to see a doctor...others had repeatedly made that suggestion so no sense in my saying it all over again.
If my lack of repeating that caution was interpreted as "no need to see the doctor" that was not my intent. I simply don't see any need to repeat what someone else says. I rarely do that with anything I post. If I had felt that there was no need for concern then I would have stated such and that would have been overstepping things. Instead I offered plausible explanations as ideas...not concrete facts...just ideas.

[sleepinglass]

Avi 123 Thanks for your input however I sincerely hope I am not a terminal case and I am sure you mean well.

I appreciate everybody's opinions and comments particularly as at the moment I am going through a bit of a physical rough patch.

Apologies Avi 123 as I may be causing confusion!

Sorry that it is not clear from the number of posts associated to my current name, but I have been around this forum for many many years on and off, as Pugsy confirms. However quite a few years back, due my losing everything on my computer inc. passwords for my email addresses, the lot, I am no longer able to log in as my old self, unfortunately.

I always find Pugsy's words very reassuring and I believe I would be more that VERY FOOLISH to believe that anybody on this site is medically trained or posses any medical training unless they clearly stated so. I would be very happy to see someone, for a change, state, that they are medically trained! I will not hold my breath while I eagerly await that day!

But until that day comes, I, as I am sure most people on this forum, would NEVER assume that anything said here was meant to be considered medical advice or guidance in any way whatsoever.

What I enjoy is, to hear people share their experiences in life, on these forums around life and apnea, both good and bad, as in doing so there is so much one can learn. People are treasure troves of experiences and kind enough to be willing to share these experiences with all of us!!!

I, like Pugsy, credit people with enough intelligence to make an informed decision, having weighed up all the odds. From the most simplistic to having that cigarette or having that cholesterol laden second cake!

I think a lot of us are here because we want the choice of managing our condition. I am not satisfied to see my sleep physician once every two years, only to find that when I do finally get to see the doc, all they are interested in is the compliance numbers!

Cpap.com and this forum have given me the freedom, not only to be in a position to buy my own machine, all those many moons ago (as they were one of the first guys to offer the possibility of people being able to do so,for which I shall always be eternally grateful) but also the benefit of learning from so many wonderful people, from all walks of life, from all over the globe, willing to give of their time to share, support and to just be there as a shoulder to lean on, for people at a time when often,as in my particular current case, one really needs it!

To answer the question where on earth did I go to have my gastroscopy done?

It was a large major teaching hospital but actually, as current resources are so stretched within out medical system, I do believe that we are on a par if not worst off than some third world country, for certain procedures, due to lack of funding.

However I have no idea if it is normal or not to be gowned up for this procedure. Maybe,(I am secretly hoping) others who have had this procedure, may put my mind at rest, when they post that they too had it done, with no gown!!

I did supposedly have my throat 'sprayed' before the procedure, but I think he missed my throat and the spray all landed on my tongue!

[Pugsy]

We do come up with some pretty cool stories don't we? Educational and entertaining too. Have you read McSnorealot's stories? His wife has to be a saint for putting up with him.

I have no idea why your abdominal discomfort has persisted. It isn't common but then not unheard of either I suppose for some people to have some residual discomfort lasting longer than normal. We all know that sometimes crap happens even under the best of circumstances though.

Was it the gagging which may have stretched some muscles (been there myself with pregnancy and all that gagging and vomiting) or was it the air introduced as part of the procedure or was it the biopsies or was it the hiatal hernia acting up because of the gagging or was it maybe a little more cpap air getting into the system because of whatever...we don't know. Lots of maybes and ideas but we don't know for sure. Have no way to know for sure unfortunately. All we can do is "suppose".

Extreme severe pain (highly subjective I know) along with fever or nausea and vomiting or blood the vomitus or in the stools (dark for stomach blood and bright red for rectal) warrants for sure getting things checked out. That is pretty much standard follow up instructions for any of the scoping procedures (depending on which end gets scoped).

A slow abdominal bleed...not impossible but not very common either. It should hurt like the devil BUT some people have a high threshold for pain and what they think is a minor pain to take an aspirin for...is another person screaming bloody murder to get a morphine shot for the pain.

When in doubt or when you are truly concerned....get things checked out. If nothing more than going in and getting temp and blood pressure checked and reassured that things are okay...but if belly pain is pretty bad and going on this long and not getting any better or is in fact getting worse....get things check out. After this length of time it is better to be safe than sorry and continued discomfort is not the norm. Perhaps someone should do an abdominal rebound test on your belly and see if it lights up the pain. Not hard to do..just a little thumping on the belly with fingers.

Chances are it is nothing serious but there is always the remote chance that a problem has occurred and sometimes peace of mind is worth a lot. If you are no better...or are in fact worse...time to quit what iffing on the internet and get someone to check your belly out.

[sleepinglass]

Thanks Pugsy

Had it checked out by my general physician last week who says that it is nothing to worry about just normal and just gave a load of anti acids.

Good news is, next week I am going to the same hospital this time to have a barium swallow done!

Gee, I just can't wait. I just wonder how they can mess that up!!

[avi123]

It's gone!

[nanwilson]

Pugsy, it seems to me that sleepinglass either don't have proper medical insurance or is low on income. You posted that sleepinglass is smart but it does not show from the poor medical treatment so far. Barium swallow test, is done as a cheap test. Endoscopy (upper and lower) done by a GI is the golden approach. But it costs more. The whole thread is useless imo. Why ask laymen in this forum about non respiration medical problem, unless it is for seeking attention.

Avi..you have just embarrassed and pissed off two members at one shot. If you don't have something good to say then don't say anything. Just because your advice was refuted does not give you the right to say the things that you have. My dad used to have an appropriate saying ...."mouth in motion, mind at stop"........do you understand this?

[DoriC]

Nan, you forgot one thing, Avi just embarrassed himself big time! I had been noticing that Avi appeared to be mellowing in some of his recent posts and I was beginning to enjoy reading them. I was supposing that the positive change had to do with his finally getting successful therapy, but, alas, me thinks he's in need of another pressure adjustment. Of all people to mess with, who would ever pick on our wonderful Pugsy who is a godsend to us. I don't know sleepinglass(at least not by that name) but she posted an intelligent and important thread and I'm sure Pugsy and others have given her good suggestions to ponder from their personal knowledge. Sleepinglass,I wish I had some useful idea to throw out to you but all I can offer you is a check if you're low on cash!

[sleepinglass]

Actually Av123 none of your assumptions are correct, not even a single one,fortunately for me, at any rate.

You are not able to understand where I am coming from and by your harsh words, appear to be passing erroneous judgement about my situation.

I can only therefore assume, you are not in the slightest bit interested in attempting to comprehend,which of course is no mandatory, where I am at or about!

I do not mind that you think I am mentally deficient, that is ok by me as I have no problem with that, if that is what you wish to think, please be my guest. You are welcome and I wish you happiness and offer my sincerest apologies if I have caused you annoyance in some way.

I also wish to take the opportunity of thanking all the lovely kind people who have supported me through this difficult time with their kind thoughts suggestion and the sharing of their personal experiences, all of which I have found very helpful indeed regarding apnea and my stomach issues and the exploration of the possible relationship or otherwise, between the two. Thank BIG you!

[sleepinglass]

Sorry typo should have read:
BIG thank you

[NightMonkey]

Actually Av123 none of your assumptions are correct, not even a single one

But he is kind of fun to have around as long as Pugsy and DoriC put up a good barrier between Avi and the patients needing help.

[palerider]

Im sorry but you are all wrong. i used a cpap machine for 2 months and it really F***ed my chest up. gave me a hernia and made my breathing worse. Trying to exhale against pressure messes your chest up

as anyone ever noticed how much bullshit is posted by people who don't give a damn enough to register?

"you're all wrong, I'm RIGHT" uh... suuuuure.