What if....?

I was just thinking. This is a huuuuge business for the mask and machine companies. (Of course, we all pretty much know that already) If they invented something to cure apnea..some type of surgical procedure to keep the airway open...imagine how it would affect the people who make this stuff. SSSSSO much at stake. I wonder if it keeps them from inventing something. Might put a LOT of people out of work if there was a cure. There has to be a type of "stent" they could put in that had an electrical type of something (not an inventor)LOL that would sense when the airway was closing, and push it open. A device that would sit on your bedstand just like the CPAP...with a line to your throat and the electrical impulse "stent" that opened. In the future, when they invent that...I'll be wishing I was the one who invented it LOL

Ok, I'll wake up now

Valid points, I suppose. Biggest problem I can think of in your theory is that the surgical fields and the DME's/manufacturers are not connected in any way. In other words, if the surgeons could find a reliable procedure that would eliminate the need for CPAP, they'd do it without even considering the manufacturing end of the economy. They are just doctors, not economists.

As annoying as CPAP is.....do you all realize it only began to be used for the general public beginning in 1981? 25 years ago. Before that, there was nothing. So kiss that darling little CPAP machine good night tonight. Just a generation earlier and we'd all be suffering. We are SOOOOOO lucky to have it available to us.

Jan in Colo.

Okay, Barb, you are waking up and I must have been falling asleep. Reread your post and realized that I bet what you are suggesting could be possible...sort of like a transderm stimulator? Like they use for chronic pain? Probably could be done...at some point...by somebody...

Not sure that I would take to an electrical current that I connect to my throat every night any better than I'm adjusting to a rush of air down my nose....but who knows?

Half of inventing, Barb, is being able to visualize the idea. You just might have an inventor hiding somewhere in your brain!

Jan in Colo.

Funny you mention surgical approach to OSA as a cure.

Seems to me that people that get a MMA/GA are having great results. The success rate I believe is around 90%... Yes, 90%! But were talking a very serious and complicated surgery. Its only reccomended for people that just can't get great relief from anything else, and I would say its only for severe apnea. Moving your whole jaw is an extremely big deal!@

A guy on sleepnet.com had a MMA done. He posted his whole experience in a
blog.

http://www.robotics.com/mma

On the flip side the inventor of such a gizmo/medical device would probably profit if they inveted a cpapless solution that is effective and less risky than current surgical procedures.

Swordz
Can you please give me the references for the claim of 90% effectivity for surgery?
Everything I've read says that surgery is a LAST resort and is WAY less than 90% effective. I won't quote an exact percentage as I don't remember the number I read and I won't want to give out misleading information.

Barb

I have to agree with you! There will be someone out there that will discover something better than what we are doing right now.

In fact I definitely feel that in 20 years from now we will be telling our grandchildren and they will be in disbelief as to the fact that we slept with this grey shoebox machine beside our bed with a 6 foot hose attached to a mask to put air pressure through our nose. (it may look something like an IPOD or something and instead of ear plugs it will be nose plugs, and maybe you can carry it in your pocket!)

I know CPAP came out in the early 80's but that is a long time ago and our generation needs something better. Unfortunately at this time there is no other choice. I know there must be a lot of good people out there working on this and it is just a matter of time before there is a replacement!

Lisa

Notice that I did mention that the surgery is extreme, and by far means overkill for many people. As far as the 90% fact, I'll ask on TAS, as that's where the original poster was.

Ha, 4got to login. Last post was me. You'd think after 100 posts I'd learn how!

It's already in the works:

Pacemaker for OSA treatment

Swordz wrote:Ha, 4got to login. Last post was me. You'd think after 100 posts I'd learn how!

Congratulations on 100, Swordz!
Esther
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Can you please give me the references for the claim of 90% effectivity for surgery?
Everything I've read says that surgery is a LAST resort and is WAY less than 90% effective.

sleepyinsunnyvale, you're absolutely correct about most surgeries for OSA being far below 90% effective as a "cure."

When people talk about surgery for OSA, they are usually talking about the mostly ineffective UPPP surgery. imho, everyone ought to be warned away from having that done!

Swordz however, was talking about a very specific different kind of surgery - MMA (Maxillomandibular advancement) -- moving the entire jaw forward surgically. Very extreme. Very effective. Of course the success of such a drastic surgery would depend a great deal on the skill of the surgeon.

There's a fellow who posts on the TAS message board under the nickname billinseattle. His posts are "must" reading, imho, for anyone who wants to know the pros and cons of all kinds of surgery for sleep apnea. He researched them all thoroughly. He's one who has written about the high percentage rate of success with MMA surgery. He also cautions that it's not a step to take lightly. He also cautions against having UPPP surgery.

Where billinseattle got his 90% success figure for MMA surgery, I don't know. But I think if you go to the MMA UPPP topics near the bottom of the page in the link below, and read a few of billinseattle's extremely intelligent posts about MMA surgery, you'll see why I'd have confidence that he found sound reasons during his own exhaustive research to place a high success rate figure on THAT particular surgery (MMA) as a cure for OSA. That surgery only...not for surgeries in general for OSA, and certainly not for UPPP surgery.

LINKS to surgery, turbinates, Pillar, TAP experiences

Again, I want to say you're right to raise a red flag, sleepyinsunnyvale, whenever the word "surgery" comes up in connection to curing OSA. UPPP being the most commonly thought of surgery, and probably the most widely performed....as well as most widely unsuccessful as a cure or even as much help at all.

Thanks for the clarification. Very informative post (as usual).

neversleeps wrote:It's already in the works:

Pacemaker for OSA treatment

Wow. A person like me...who has NEVER done good in a school situation....could think of something like this...amazes me LOL I think I missed my calling


=================================
Relief is on the way for loud, heavy snorers with obstructive sleep apnea (OSA). Researchers at Case Western Reserve University are developing an implanted medical device slightly larger than a postage stamp to help 20 million Americans who suffer from the sleep disorder. The device will operate like a heart pacemaker.

"We would like to see OSA syndrome patients sleep better, feel better and lead better and healthier lives," said Dominique Durand, the lead researcher and professor in the department of biomedical engineering and Neurosciences.

Those who suffer from obstructive sleep apnea experience significant breathing cessations causing an array of complications such as a decrease in blood oxygen levels, sleep fragmentation, irregularities in the heart's normal beating pattern, and hypertension.

"This serious disorder can become a major health risk, causing significant lung, neurocognitive deficits and heart disease over time," said Durand.

Although obstructive sleep apnea is associated with known chronic diseases such as obesity, hypertension, heart failure, stroke, sexual dysfunction, and depression, a short list of remedies exist. The primary treatment is an external mask that forces oxygen into the airway and provides continuous oxygen pressure (CPAP).

The tiny device underway at Case is designed to offer relief to those who find the current CPAP masks uncomfortable. It will consist of an electrode, several leads and a 3cm diameter stimulator and it will be surgically implanted below the ear in the neck where it will directly stimulate a targeted part of the hypoglossal nerve which controls movement of the muscles involved in maintaining the opening of the upper airways.

"This new generation of neural prosthetics for obstructive sleep apnea is inspired by advancements like the experimental diaphragm pacing system designed at Case that now helps actor Christopher Reeve breathe more naturally," said Durand. "Our miniature device is being designed to both stimulate and record from the hypoglossal nerve to detect and prevent an obstruction before it takes place, eliminating those gaps in breathe, quieting the loud snore that comes with it and helping people to rest better."

Minor surgery under the care of a certified otorhinolaryngologist will be involved when the device reaches the commercial market. "The good news is that the hypoglossal nerve is close to the surface which will keep the invasive process to a minimum," said Durand.

Hey, where do we sign up?
Esther
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