New, Severe, Really Concerned

[DreamDiver]

Not a perfect night. But Powered through the apneas or whatever is happening immediately upon falling asleep. I could fell and know the postions where my O2 levels drop etc but instead of rolling over, I just forced through it. That must be why the pressure raised so high. So far the higher the pressure goes, the worse the AHI night has been. Chicken or egg scenario.

Wondering what it will feel like to have an AHI of 1 for a whole night of sleep!

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From about 3 to about 4:15 am, it looks like you're mostly awake. I have to wonder if you wouldn't be better off with an AirSense 10 Autoset.

Chris

[NewToSleepApnea]

Yes that whole period from 215-415am I battled through what I was considering "Transitional Apnea". Those episodes that happen just before I feel asleep and my O2 drops. Its miserable feeling, sometimes I wear a Pulse Oximeter that my wife will watch, or I will open an eye and peak at it when I think its bad. But I can feel when my body starts to change during those episodes.

Previously I haven't been able to sleep though those and I try to change my position and end up not sleeping at all. Last night I just said screw it and let it drop and was able to sleep for a bit. The pressure kept waking me up too I believe.

So far my "Sleep doctors" have said my experience isnt typical. But screwed right now with Covid - can't get a sleep lab.

[DreamDiver]

...
So far my "Sleep doctors" have said my experience isnt typical. But screwed right now with Covid - can't get a sleep lab.

I hope you can get a new sleep lab soon, or at least talk with a sleep doc.

Chris

[palerider]

So far the higher the pressure goes, the worse the AHI night has been. Chicken or egg scenario.

Turn off the AHI graph, it's completely useless.

There's no "Chicken or egg scenario." Obstructive *events*, some of which make up the AHI (Apneas and hypopneas), cause the pressure to increase.

Why are there such long periods that you aren't using your machine during the night?

Did the improved pressure bother you? or seem to help you, if so, bump it up to 10, maybe higher.

[palerider]

Yes that whole period from 215-415am I battled through what I was considering "Transitional Apnea".

The only time I see possible transition apneas is between around 3:12-4:17, that's where there's some centrals showing up.

[NewToSleepApnea]

Thanks DreamDiver, My first two sleep doctors basically said, give it awhile.
The first one didnt even understand what settings meant (had to tell him about easy start that killed me the first two days)

The second one didn't understand what Oscar was, and said she can't get any data until they do a sleep lab. I'm finding these sleep doctors rely on the sleep technicians to tell them what to really do. She said what is happening to me isn't typical but without a sleep lab, no idea why. Both dismissed any chance of me having Centrals initially because "its so uncommon"

In talks with a 3rd out of state who seems 1000x better.

I'm getting a "sniff test" of the lungs later today to see diaphram movement but I doubt that will help because I feel pretty good during the day.
My PCP originally thought this was all anxiety and nothing to do with sleep apnea. This is all made way harder because of Covid, but I live in a great state for healthcare (Massachusetts). Can only imagine what happens to you guys who live in much different areas.

Palerider -

From 312-417 - that's about the time that I had just trying to power through. I am concerned knowing when my O2 level is going down, I'm awake for sure. Maybe in some type of limbo.

The added pressure I dont love. But right now If I start the ramp at 9 then I can get used to it for a bit before it ramps up. Then I'm usually good until over 15 for now. But definitely working on it.

The break in usage is me trying to recover. When I wake up gasping and O2 levels in the 80's (or feeling like it if I am not wearing the oximeter), it is tough to go back to sleep. I'll get up, walk around, get some water etc. Sometimes it's from me laying down for the past 60/90mins not being able to sleep so I get up and go watch TV or read until I get sleepy again.

I think this morning, I stopped it at 630 (phone call) but dozed back off to sleep for an hour with the mask on without the machine on unfortunately. But I didnt wake up at all during it. Wasnt expecting to go to sleep that fast.

[nicholasjh1]

Quick question, you guys are so knowledgeable -

Has anyone ever heard of severe sleep apnea appearing out of no where one day? Besides getting it under control, that’s what the doctor are concerned about now - the suddenness.

No but I had sleep apnea for years with out knowing it. I just slept through the suffocation and low oxygen without waking up... or if I did wake up I basically went right back to sleep and blacked out about waking up. I do remember a period when I woke up a lot in my mid 20's... never remember catching my breathe but I might not have been fully roused at that point.

In addition when ever I took cannabis when I was undiagnosed I'd sleep right through the night but wake up feeling groggy and hung over(probably from severe oxygen depravation). Much worse then if I slept through the night without it. I'm sure I had apnea's without it but my natural rousing mechanisms kept my oxygen from going too low (presumably since on a 'normal' night of apnea I only felt kind of tired the next day.

Either way, tl/dr you could easily have had apnea for quite a while without realizing it for quite a while.

[DreamDiver]

Refresh my memory... Are you using a recording oximeter? Can you just record the night? It may help clarify things.

Chris

[palerider]

The break in usage is me trying to recover. When I wake up gasping and O2 levels in the 80's (or feeling like it if I am not wearing the oximeter), it is tough to go back to sleep.

Waking up gasping is a sign of obstructive apneas, and thus, too little pressure.

[NewToSleepApnea]

No I don't have a recording oximeter. But I can feel myself slip into unconsciousness. And I can force myself to breath whenever I want, but I'll wake up. So I just let myself slip into it and its as if my body forgets how to breath on its own.

The oximeters I have used (two) have never went into the 80's at any time except when I am asleep. And there have been a few times i have slept thru it (according to my wife). But 90% of the time that i wake up and look at her and say "My O2 is down right" she says Yes and I look and its 90 or below.

So I have no idea. I feel like my choice is suffocate for a moment and go to sleep, or voluntary breath and wake up. I know it sounds dumb, and the OSCAR data doesn't necessarily show it. But that feeling hasn't changed in 17 days. With or without the CPAP machine.

[Pugsy]

If you want to try a lot more pressure minimum I see no reason to not try it just to see if it stops whatever you are having that might be causing the symptoms you are having.

From what I see on the detailed data that I have available to zoom in on......doesn't look like you ever really are transitioning to sleep but again....the data the machine offers us isn't anything near like what is out there available under better circumstances in a lab situation.
Looks more like SWJ to me but I have only one thing to look at and it's not 100% perfect....and neither am I.

If you have trouble comfort wise adjusting to a lot more minimum pressure...go up slowly in small increments.

[DreamDiver]

...

So I have no idea. I feel like my choice is suffocate for a moment and go to sleep, or voluntary breath and wake up. I know it sounds dumb, and the OSCAR data doesn't necessarily show it. But that feeling hasn't changed in 17 days. With or without the CPAP machine.

Just to get a clear picture: you're using both the cpap and an oximeter set to wake you up if your O2 goes too low. It comes across that you may be too frazzled to trust either machine to actually go to sleep. You could continue using the oximeter set to wake you up, but that's just another wake trigger. If you had a recording oximeter, you could set it, forget it, wake up in the morning and compare graphs. Watching your oximeter in real time may be working against your favor. Do you think you could just refrain from using the oximeter and trust the cpap machine do its work?

Also, Palerider and Pugsy suggested upping your minimum. Why not give that a go?

Chris

[NewToSleepApnea]

I am continuing to up the minimum little by little to be able to handle the pressure. But definitely doing that.

I don't have the oximeter set to wake me up. I only wear it from time to time in bed. If I feel myself dropping O2 frequently I'll put it on for the next sleep attempt and sometimes will open my eye to see if its really as low as it feels (Usually, if not always is). OR, if my Wife happens to be awake (We have two small children so sometimes shes up feeding the baby) I'll have her watch the Oximeter on my finger while I sleep.

Atleast 75 I am only using the CPAP not the Oximeter.

Instead of moving or adjusting or waking up while I felt myself start to "fall asleep" but lose O2, last night I fought through it. Made my AHI go up a ton with Central Apneas. But I got more hours of "Sleep". I don't know if its better to let me O2 drop to get sleep or stop and adjust to try to find a new position.

[DreamDiver]

...
Instead of moving or adjusting or waking up while I felt myself start to "fall asleep" but lose O2, last night I fought through it. Made my AHI go up a ton with Central Apneas. But I got more hours of "Sleep". I don't know if its better to let me O2 drop to get sleep or stop and adjust to try to find a new position.

Trust the DreamStation. Try not using the oximeter. I hope you'll consider trying Palerider's suggestion.

Chris

[NewToSleepApnea]

Yea I had it at 9.5 min. Maybe I’ll raise it to ten.