Paramedics . . . C-PAP . . . ambulance . . .

[jnk]

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument

Wouldn't they be using bilevel if it is used in place of intubation and a ventilator? Hmmm.

"The C-PAP is less invasive and less expensive than a trachea tube and ventilator. And in emergencies where people have trouble breathing, it gets air in and out of the lungs faster."

[Babette]

I want a $60 disposable CPAP. I've got asthma. Think I'll fake an attack and get a cute paramedic to give me one....

JNK, I think for a short ride, they are probably just hooking up to straight 10cm just to get the patient to the hospital where more advanced therapies can be arranged.

Unless the patient is an xpap patient, and they fight it, and insist they stop and reset the machine to 11-14, with Cflex of 2, and HH of 3.

If used as just emergency air flow, I'd guess it's probably just straight 10cm, with no cflex or epr or anything.

Particularly for a $60 disposable machine....

If they are giving away APAPs at that price, I'm definitely faking an attack...

LOL,
Babs

[jnk]

I guess this has been around for a while.

http://www.merginet.com/index.cfm?pg=airway&fn=CPAPuser

". . . Patients who have had CPAP may request it when you arrive at their side but CPAP can also be a frightening experience for those who have never been on it before. Some patients will even try to pull the mask off. . . . So you must calmly tell them that while they may feel a little uncomfortable at first, they should feel much better in a few minutes. Explain that the sensation is similar to sticking your head out the window of a moving car. . . ."

Does that mean that if my electricity goes off at night I should just go get in my car and drive around with my head out the window? What speed would I have to go to get 10 cm of pressure, I wonder?

[Slinky]

Gads, jnk!!! The Subject title of your post scared the devil outta me! I thought you'd had a BAD day and just gotten home or something!!

I'd read this or similar not too long ago. I thought it interesting. Only the article I read didn't mention a $60 CPAP. Maybe some old, early Respironics or Sullivans on some back shelves, dusted off and put to work???

Someone else just mentioned to me that Liberty Mutual is now offering CPAP supplies in their TV commercials. They will bill Medicare and your secondary, blah, blah, blah like they do for their diabetes stuff. Shades of Wilford Brimley!!! I didn't think to ask who they have doing the CPAP supplies commercials.

[jnk]

Didn't mean to scare you, Slinky! I found the story very interesting, that it was becoming so common. Maybe everybody should be on CPAP to get used to it, just in case! Or maybe we should all keep a spare CPAP machine in the trunks of our cars as part of our first aid kit.

Here in NYC, the NYPD refers to asthma emergency calls as "difficulty breathers." "Eight-four charlie, you've got a difficulty breather at the corner of . . ." Sounds to me like severe asthma patients should have a machine on standby.

[Guest]

I could be wrong but I think the one time use CPAP device they are referring to is the mask. $60 may be what the ambulance Co. pays but not likely what they will charge the patient. I seriously doubt the machine is a one-time-use device
In the past they waited for the patient to go unconscious to intubate. So yea, this is a good thing.

The one-time-use C-PAP devices cost about $60 each. The device goes with the patient into the hospital, where it can be hooked up to an oxygen source in the patient's room.

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument

[Slinky]

Oh, duh! That does make more sense, Guest!!

[jnk]

. . . offering CPAP supplies in their TV commercials. . . . Shades of Wilford Brimley!!! I didn't think to ask who they have doing the CPAP supplies commercials.

I wonder if Snoredog has an agent?

Or if Still Another Guest has a SAG card?

I hope they don't use thedean, or they ain't gonna sell diddly.

[tangents]

Explain that the sensation is similar to sticking your head out the window of a moving car. . . ."

Love the air!

Cathy

[Babette]

Sooo..... You think we can early diagnose future cpap patients by noting how much the kid really insists that he/she be driven around in a car in order to fall asleep?

I know *I* was one of those high-maintenance babies...

LOL,
Babs

[BrianRT]

Actually, I was driving around and had a digital pressure manometer laying in the passenger seat and decided to stick it out the window at different speeds since I have wondered the same thing.

Now, keep in mind that the airflow is VERY turbulent and nowhere near as laminar as the controlled environment of a CPAP mask and hose and the exact pressure would jump a little.....

So...

50mph = 3.7-4.2 cm H20

I increased to 60 mph and found it increased around 1 cmH20 to around 5 cmH20 with the same fluctuation....

I wasn't near an interstate to see if 70mph would be around 6 cmH20 but the first two do put things in perspective.

I certainly concur with jnk, a bilevel would make it a lot easier since someone already in distress is going to have some exhalation difficulties, say, in an asthma attack. You could even hook a nebulizer treatment inline to really help with medication deposition ala IPPB.

[Babette]

Hey Brian!!! Did you test this outside the local Waffle House?

Well, GOOD TO KNOW that we can't just rely on sticking our heads out the window all night while our spousal equivalents drive us from overcrowded motel to packed convention center after we lose power due to an Awesome Act of God.

WAFFLES!
Babs

[BrianRT]

Oh, my dear Babs....you know how it can be....

....sometimes your the waffle....

....and sometimes your the syrup

I'm surprised the forum still had me in the databanks. It's been a long time. Free time is fleeting but I will try to make it more regularly on here.

Cheers All!

[jnk]

I was driving around and had a digital pressure manometer laying in the passenger seat . . .

I'm not gonna ask. But part of me finds that statement somehow disturbing.

50mph = 3.7-4.2 cm H20

Doubt I could get my Corolla up to 100 mph on the BQE and still live to tell the tale. But if I ever find myself in an ambulance and having a hard time breathing, I should ask the EMT boys just to stick my head out the window, turn on the lights and siren, and floor that baby. (Oh, wait, I live in NYC--breathing unfiltered air here is unhealthy enough at 0 cm! So maybe not.)

Thanks BrianRT. Very interesting.

With all the air rushing into the face, no problem with mouth leaks and lip flutters, cause it would all be in the opposite direction! And for bilevel action, one could simply turn one's head forward then backward every few seconds, right?!

jeff

[BrianRT]

Turning the head for bipap?....Brilliant!!

I can see the research paper now...

Manual Application Of Bi-level Positive Pressure Via Variable Applied Automotive Processes. September 2008, jnk, BrianRT, babette, et.al

BTW, the manometer was from a home visit to calibrate a CPAP......it's usually my blow-up doll so I can drive in the carpool lanes! Yeah, that's the reason