AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

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ChicagoGranny
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AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by ChicagoGranny » Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:43 am

"In November 2017 the Minnesota Department of Health announced the decision to add obstructive sleep apnea as a new qualifying condition for the state's medical cannabis program. However, the AASM has concluded that sleep apnea should be excluded from the list of chronic medical conditions for state medical cannabis programs due to unreliable delivery methods and insufficient evidence of treatment effectiveness, tolerability and safety.

"Until we have further evidence on the efficacy of medical cannabis for the treatment of sleep apnea, and until its safety profile is established, patients should discuss proven treatment options with a licensed medical provider at an accredited sleep facility," said lead author Dr. Kannan Ramar, professor of medicine in the division of pulmonary and critical care medicine at Mayo Clinic in Rochester, Minnesota."

Full press release - https://eurekalert.org/pub_releases/201 ... 041318.php

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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by chunkyfrog » Tue Apr 17, 2018 9:51 am

That;
plus if you are buying into the "obesity causes apnea" crap,
the "munchies" could be disastrous! :shock:

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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by Pugsy » Tue Apr 17, 2018 9:55 am

It didn't give me the munchies (tried it when out in Vegas) but I was trying it for pain and sleep quality....never remotely considered it for an excuse to do without the machine.

Didn't really have enough time to give it a fair experiment but overall I didn't care for what it did to my pulse rate for one thing..and even the weakest dose they sold out there made me sick to my stomach.

I am not sure I would even want to go do it even if it did help the sleep apnea side of things...I didn't like how I felt at all.

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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by ChicagoGranny » Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:06 am

I only posted this because I thought this was a stupid move:
"In November 2017 the Minnesota Department of Health announced the decision to add obstructive sleep apnea as a new qualifying condition for the state's medical cannabis program."

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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by chunkyfrog » Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:25 am

ChicagoGranny wrote:
Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:06 am
I only posted this because I thought this was a stupid move:
"In November 2017 the Minnesota Department of Health announced the decision to add obstructive sleep apnea as a new qualifying condition for the state's medical cannabis program."
Let me guess---money? Dispensary lobbyist loot? Free lifetime pot supply?
Pallet of Twinkies?

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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by Lucyhere » Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:55 am

ChicagoGranny wrote:
Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:06 am
I only posted this because I thought this was a stupid move:
"In November 2017 the Minnesota Department of Health announced the decision to add obstructive sleep apnea as a new qualifying condition for the state's medical cannabis program."
Like Pugsy, cannabis didn't work for me either. I thought it would help me sleep -- it didn't. I also didn't like the way it made me feel. I expected something akin to what I felt years ago when I tried it. Nothing like it at all.

However, I don't think it was a stupid move. It just might work for some people.
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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by jnk... » Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:09 am

Personally, my favorite statement:
PAP therapy remains the most effective treatment option for OSA. Adherence with PAP therapy is optimized by a patient-centered approach that includes pretreatment education and ongoing follow-up. -- http://jcsm.aasm.org/ViewAbstract.aspx?pid=31249
Amen.
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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by Lucyhere » Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:20 am

I don't see it as a either or thing. I know some people who use both (CPAP and mj) successfully, so they tell me.
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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by hewl35 » Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:41 am

I use it for pain and asthma. Believe it or not vaping mj actually improved my asthma. All which helps me sleep better and longer.

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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by jnk... » Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:48 am

I hear ya, Lucyhere.

But personally I do see it as either-or, IF the question is, Which one has documented treatment potential for OSA?

Most drugs have an adverse effect on quality of sleep, even when medical use of said drug may improve sleep latency. Let's use alcohol as an example. It can "help" latency but then totally shipwreck REM later in the night/morning. And that's without even getting intoxicated.

With medical use of drugs, sometimes the benefits far outweigh the side-effects on sleep. But all drug interactions are worth full investigation by the patient, and especially OSA sufferers, and that includes interactions with therapies such as PAP therapy.

I tend to be particularly cautious with anything with a sedating/calming effect that can hinder the nervous system of a sleep-breathing-issue person from waking up during an apnea. Too many drummers have been lost to the world over the decades from a simple diphenhydramine pill that happened to follow a few tokes and a few swigs. They generally call it "choking on his own vomit" when apneas pull the stomach contents up into the lungs before a guy can wake up. Not a choice way to go, and it has deprived the world of a lot of good music over the years, I believe.

But that's just my twisted perspective as a music lover.
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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by jnk... » Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:52 am

Many things make a person feel he sleeps better. But without NPSG documentation, it is just a feeling. Not saying one way or the other. Just saying that "it makes me sleep better" does not carry weight scientifically or anecdotally in the sleep-treatment community. Feeling that one is sleeping better and proving one's sleep is actually measurably better are two very, very different things.
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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by TASmart » Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:01 pm

If MJ relaxes as is claimed by some, and reinforced by my own past experience, then it would seem to be counter-productive for OSA. THOH, back in the day, it did really improve my sleep latency in small amounts, in larger amounts it made me not want to sleep. Thus I conclude ( of course that is immaterial) that in the absence of dose relationship studies and the rigor of polysomnographic studies seems like a bad idea for SA treatment, with or without an XPAP.
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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by jnk... » Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:39 pm

Looks like the effects may be somewhat similar to alcohol on sleep stages . . .
. . . Sleep has five stages, and cannabis affects all of them. . . . Its impact on [the first] stage is positive. . . . Research claims that cannabis use decreases REM sleep . . . -- https://sleepjunkies.com/science/mariju ... id-efects/
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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by SewTired » Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:45 pm

chunkyfrog wrote:
Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:25 am
ChicagoGranny wrote:
Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:06 am
I only posted this because I thought this was a stupid move:
"In November 2017 the Minnesota Department of Health announced the decision to add obstructive sleep apnea as a new qualifying condition for the state's medical cannabis program."
Let me guess---money? Dispensary lobbyist loot? Free lifetime pot supply?
Pallet of Twinkies?
Maybe desperate people. The reality is that yes, pot has been shown to help some people with sleep apnea and related problems. Believe me, it isn't easy to get a script for medical pot in MN and you aren't going to get it unless traditional treatments fail. I'm all for it if it helps those folks.

As far as how it works, one small study indicates it evens out serotonin levels which affect sleep. In some cases, it appears to reduce limb movements and RLS, but since it doesn't do it consistently, they don't know enough. The TYPE of pot may make a difference, or none at all.

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Re: AASM - Position statement: Avoid using medical marijuana to treat sleep apnea

Post by chunkyfrog » Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:54 pm

Maybe I'm just jealous.
Nebraskans can't get it for ANYTHING--
Chemotherapy side effects, intractable epilepsy in CHILDREN,
Pain, nausea, anxiety, insomnia, you name it.
Parents brought their sick, crippled kids into the Unicameral,
and the evil politicians were completely unmoved.
I am grateful that cpap works so well for me.
If nothing worked, I wouldn't mind any kind of relief.

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