Connecting O2 to CPAP

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
wardmiller
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Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by wardmiller » Sat Mar 17, 2018 1:39 pm

I use O2 all during the day. Now I notice my saturation during the night is slipping down and when i tell my doc he probably will want me to connect up at night, too. I have been using a ResMed Quattro FX ffm for several years and it works just fine for me.

How do I connect the O2 tube to the mask, or CPAP? Do I have to get a different mask? I hate to again go through getting one that fits.

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Pugsy
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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by Pugsy » Sat Mar 17, 2018 1:49 pm

What kind of hose are you using on your S9?
Heated or non heated?

If non heated you can use something like this.
https://www.cpap.com/productpage/oxygen ... apter.html
at the long hose to humidifier junction and save on having to snake the O2 hose along side your cpap hose.

Or if using a heated hose you can of course stick it at the mask/long hose junction.

Or get the heated hose that has a built in little port for hooking up the O2 line.
https://www.cpap.com/productpage/resmed ... rt-S9.html

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wardmiller
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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by wardmiller » Sat Mar 17, 2018 2:09 pm

I'm using a non-heated hose. That adapter you first cited looks like the solution. Thanks.

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wardmiller
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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by wardmiller » Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:36 am

Pugsy, I was just about to order that T-shaped hose connection, then I had a thought. The CPAP hose puts out quite an airflow. You can feel it several feet away. The O2 machine puts out such little pressure, at 2 l/min I can't feel it when I put the tubing to my cheek. I check it by putting the tubing end in a glass of water and look for bubbles. It would appear to me the CPAP would prevent the O2 flow from exiting the tubing and entering the hose. Stated another way, if there were a flapper door in the connector where the tubing and the hose join, the CPAP air would push the door toward the tubing.

I know this is a lot like the small river flowing into the big river, and it does flow, but we are talking about much, much stronger forces there. With my O2 concentrator, it is continuous flow and there is no way I can tell if the O2 is actually leaving the tubing.

What do you think about it?

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Pugsy
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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by Pugsy » Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:47 am

People use those adapters all the time and they seem to work just fine.
We have a lot of people here on the forum using them.

Also when you first turn the machine on it does seem like there is a massive air stream to fight but that's really only until the seal is made and once the seal is made the forceful movement of the air isn't nearly so significant.

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greatunclebill
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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by greatunclebill » Sun Mar 18, 2018 8:21 am

wardmiller wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:36 am
Pugsy, I was just about to order that T-shaped hose connection, then I had a thought. The CPAP hose puts out quite an airflow. You can feel it several feet away. The O2 machine puts out such little pressure, at 2 l/min I can't feel it when I put the tubing to my cheek. I check it by putting the tubing end in a glass of water and look for bubbles. It would appear to me the CPAP would prevent the O2 flow from exiting the tubing and entering the hose. Stated another way, if there were a flapper door in the connector where the tubing and the hose join, the CPAP air would push the door toward the tubing.

I know this is a lot like the small river flowing into the big river, and it does flow, but we are talking about much, much stronger forces there. With my O2 concentrator, it is continuous flow and there is no way I can tell if the O2 is actually leaving the tubing.

What do you think about it?
this is often asked by people new to the o2 game. it's apples and oranges. cpap is very low pressure and high volume. think of standing in front of a fan. o2 is higher pressure and low volume. the high cpap pressure that people complain about is only .3psi. the o2 pressure whether out of a cylinder or concentrater is many times higher than the cpap pressure. the 2L per hour flow from the concentrator is volume, not pressure. bottom line: plug it in, turn it on and go to sleep. it blends together just fine.

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wardmiller
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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by wardmiller » Sun Mar 18, 2018 9:53 am

Pugsy and Bill, thank you for those replies. I'll order one today.

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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by Goofproof » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:44 pm

wardmiller wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:36 am
The O2 machine puts out such little pressure, at 2 l/min I can't feel it when I put the tubing to my cheek.

I know this is a lot like the small river flowing into the big river, and it does flow, but we are talking about much, much stronger forces there. With my O2 concentrator, it is continuous flow and there is no way I can tell if the O2 is actually leaving the tubing.

What do you think about it?
Totally Flawed thinking!

1. The O2 Concentrator pressure and flow volume are two different animals. Flow is the amount of something, pressure is the push behind it. The O2 Concentrator, doesn't build it pressure until it's flow is restricted, the pressure is measured in .cm of water level, the Flow is controlled by a regulator gauge. they are built into the O2 unit or mounted on the tank. If yours doesn't have one, get one.

About the Small River flowing into the Big River, What makes a Big River, Water flowing into it! How does water flow, down hill, from higher to lower. XPAPS are supposed to be used with Full Flow O2 Only!

The O2 Concentrator pressure IS higher than your XPAP pressure, that's why the O2 goes into the XPAP airstream. The reason the Small river or Stream goes into the Big River is the same the Small river or Stream's level is higher than the Big River, It has more pressure.

Put your finger on the O2 hose and seal it off when it's running you will feel the pressure building up, the pressure exceeds the XPAP pressure by a lot, the flow does not, the XPAP flow is much higher.

I use 3 L of O2, because I realize much of the added O2 is washed out of the mask by the mask vent, it's common sense, but that's not taught in med school, it's learned by life, or not! Jim
Use data to optimize your xPAP treatment!

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wardmiller
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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by wardmiller » Sun Mar 18, 2018 2:35 pm

Goofproof wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:44 pm

Totally Flawed thinking!
...
I use 3 L of O2, because I realize much of the added O2 is washed out of the mask by the mask vent, it's common sense, but that's not taught in med school, it's learned by life, or not! Jim
Thanks for the education.

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Goofproof
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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by Goofproof » Sun Mar 18, 2018 3:22 pm

wardmiller wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 2:35 pm
Goofproof wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:44 pm

Totally Flawed thinking!
...
I use 3 L of O2, because I realize much of the added O2 is washed out of the mask by the mask vent, it's common sense, but that's not taught in med school, it's learned by life, or not! Jim
Thanks for the education.
I start the O2 unit, start the XPAP at my full pressure, put the mask on, then adjust my O2 flow on the O2 unit. that way i'm sure the O2 is correct, As far as the O2 rate 2 L is fine, I just want more. Jim

Also there are more than one kind of bleed in adapter, mine is safer than most it has a check valve built in. When you turn the XPAP off, the check valve stops th O2 flow from going back into the XPAP by dumping the added O2 into the room, downside the Smartstart won't work with it, no problem, (I can't find one like it, just cheap ones). I always turn my own on. I also keep the O2 unit in the next room (50 feet line max), keeping the heat and noise out of the bedroom.
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palerider
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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by palerider » Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:32 pm

wardmiller wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:36 am
Pugsy, I was just about to order that T-shaped hose connection, then I had a thought. The CPAP hose puts out quite an airflow. You can feel it several feet away. The O2 machine puts out such little pressure, at 2 l/min I can't feel it when I put the tubing to my cheek. I check it by putting the tubing end in a glass of water and look for bubbles. It would appear to me the CPAP would prevent the O2 flow from exiting the tubing and entering the hose. Stated another way, if there were a flapper door in the connector where the tubing and the hose join, the CPAP air would push the door toward the tubing.

I know this is a lot like the small river flowing into the big river, and it does flow, but we are talking about much, much stronger forces there. With my O2 concentrator, it is continuous flow and there is no way I can tell if the O2 is actually leaving the tubing.

What do you think about it?
The oxygen concentrator has *much* higher pressure than the cpap.

How much air you can feel blowing out the cpap hose when it's not connected is totally irrelevant, because it's running at full speed, trying to pressurize your entire room.

If those O2 adapters didn't work (they do) they wouldn't sell them, and Pugsy wouldn't have recommended them.

(my housemate uses one on his cpap.)

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palerider
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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by palerider » Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:36 pm

palerider wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:32 pm
wardmiller wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:36 am
Pugsy, I was just about to order that T-shaped hose connection, then I had a thought. The CPAP hose puts out quite an airflow. You can feel it several feet away. The O2 machine puts out such little pressure, at 2 l/min I can't feel it when I put the tubing to my cheek. I check it by putting the tubing end in a glass of water and look for bubbles. It would appear to me the CPAP would prevent the O2 flow from exiting the tubing and entering the hose. Stated another way, if there were a flapper door in the connector where the tubing and the hose join, the CPAP air would push the door toward the tubing.

I know this is a lot like the small river flowing into the big river, and it does flow, but we are talking about much, much stronger forces there. With my O2 concentrator, it is continuous flow and there is no way I can tell if the O2 is actually leaving the tubing.

What do you think about it?
The oxygen concentrator has *much* higher pressure than the cpap.

How much air you can feel blowing out the cpap hose when it's not connected is totally irrelevant, because it's running at full speed, trying to pressurize your entire room.

If those O2 adapters didn't work (they do) they wouldn't sell them, and Pugsy wouldn't have recommended them.

(my housemate uses one on his cpap.)

As to how you can tell whether it's flowing or not, you look at the flowmeter on the concentrator.

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wardmiller
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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by wardmiller » Mon Mar 19, 2018 7:26 am

greatunclebill wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 8:21 am

. . . the 2L per hour flow from the concentrator. . .
I believe you meant "per minute", not "per hour". Right?

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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by ChicagoGranny » Mon Mar 19, 2018 7:43 am

wardmiller wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:36 am
The CPAP hose puts out quite an airflow. You can feel it several feet away. The O2 machine puts out such little pressure, at 2 l/min I can't feel it when I put the tubing to my cheek. I check it by putting the tubing end in a glass of water and look for bubbles. It would appear to me the CPAP would prevent the O2 flow from exiting the tubing and entering the hose.

I know this is a lot like the small river flowing into the big river, and it does flow, but we are talking about much, much stronger forces there. With my O2 concentrator, it is continuous flow and there is no way I can tell if the O2 is actually leaving the tubing.
Actually, the oxygen concentrator creates a pressure many times higher than any CPAP pressure. The concentrator has a pressure reducing valve to allow the correct amount of oxygen to flow through the hose that is connected to the patient.

Concentrator/CPAP systems are a proven science with a history of thousands of patients.

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Re: Connecting O2 to CPAP

Post by wardmiller » Mon Mar 19, 2018 7:52 am

palerider wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:32 pm

The oxygen concentrator has *much* higher pressure than the cpap.

How much air you can feel blowing out the cpap hose when it's not connected is totally irrelevant, because it's running at full speed, trying to pressurize your entire room.
Just for the record, after I have worn the CPAP mask for many minutes, I can feel the airflow out of the mask's vent 16" away or more. When set to 2 L/min, I can not feel oxygen coming out of the concentrator's tubing, but I know it is working if I put the tubing in a glass of water and see bubbles.
palerider wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:32 pm
If those O2 adapters didn't work (they do) they wouldn't sell them. . .
I don't know where you lived, but around here we can buy plenty of stuff that does not work as advertised. Some is even mentioned on this forum from time to time.

Also, please note the advertisement say, "Return On Warranty Issues Only". Does not provide for return if it fails to work as advertised.

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