Sleeping only 3 or 4 hours with CPAP

tedtomato · Post by **tedtomato** » Mon Dec 05, 2016 1:52 pm

Hi,

I have been on CPAP for only a few weeks, and I am still getting used to it.

I have noticed over the last few nights that I tend to go to sleep fairly quickly now (while it was a struggle when I started CPAP) but only stay asleep for 3 or 4 hours. I therefore wake up at 1am or 2am, quite refreshed and feeling well. However, I struggle to go back to sleep with the mask and machine on, so I go back to sleep without CPAP, and wake up more tired.

Is this usual?

I am assuming 3 or 4 hours is matching a sleep cycle?

T.

ChicagoGranny · Post by **ChicagoGranny** » Mon Dec 05, 2016 1:56 pm

tedtomato wrote:I go back to sleep without CPAP, and wake up more tired.

As a general rule, later in the night more time is spent in REM sleep. In REM sleep, the airway muscles are at maximum relaxation, and therefore, sleep apnea is likely to be more severe. So, yes, your habit could cause great fatigue the next day.

Here is a checklist for good sleep:

- Practice good sleep hygiene (Google it and read several sources)
- Eat a good diet
- Have a regular, moderate exercise program
- Try to avoid daytime naps
- Practice total abstinence of caffeine including sources like chocolate (sigh)
- Review all medicines, vitamins and supplements you are taking to make sure none are interfering with sleep
- Use the bedroom for sleeping (and sex) only, and make sure the bedroom and bed are comfortable.
- Learn to appropriately handle emotional stress in your life
- Do not listen to your breathing or the sound of the machine as you are falling asleep.
- Distract your mind by thinking of a pleasant, relaxing activity that you enjoy. Thinking of sitting under an umbrella on a quiet beach with a warm gentle breeze works for me.
- Use CPAP software, such as the free SleepyHead, to make sure your therapy is optimized
- If you still don't feel or sleep well, make sure you have regular medical checkups to confirm there are no other medical problems

CG

ChicagoGranny · Post by **ChicagoGranny** » Mon Dec 05, 2016 2:03 pm

tedtomato wrote:stay asleep for 3 or 4 hours

If you follow good sleep hygiene, and this problem continues, here is something that some have had success with. Don't go to bed until 3 or 4 hours before time to arise. If you are able to sleep with CPAP until time to arise, try this for a few nights. Then, start gradually backing up bedtime until you get to the point you are sleeping (with CPAP) the amount you need to feel rested all day - this is typically 6 to 8 hours for adults.

tedtomato · Post by **tedtomato** » Mon Dec 05, 2016 2:07 pm

So you are saying that REM does not necessarily happen during each sleep cycle?

When I did my home sleep study, I only tolerated all that equipment (and being forced to sleep on my back) for about 3.5 hours. AHI measured was only about 7, so I guess it could have been much worse if a full night had been measured (and not much REM happening during the measurement period)?

With CPAP for 3 or 4 hours, the AHI is now lower than 1.8 on average, but then I only tend to sleep for 3 or 4 hours with the machine on.

I guess I would be interested to know why I am waking up after 3 or 4 hours each night (I was sleeping through a full 8 hour night before CPAP).

In term of overall sleep quality, my doctor said that remembering dreams would be an indication but still not remembering anything now (so I guess little REM sleep)

tedtomato · Post by **tedtomato** » Mon Dec 05, 2016 2:09 pm

ChicagoGranny wrote: If you follow good sleep hygiene, and this problem continues, here is something that some have had success with. Don't go to bed until 3 or 4 hours before time to arise. If you are able to sleep with CPAP until time to arise, try this for a few nights. Then, start gradually backing up bedtime until you get to the point you are sleeping (with CPAP) the amount you need to feel rested all day - this is typically 6 to 8 hours for adults.

Makes perfect sense. However, I am very tired by 10pm, and couldn't stay awake until 3 or 4am...

ChicagoGranny · Post by **ChicagoGranny** » Mon Dec 05, 2016 4:03 pm

tedtomato wrote:So you are saying that REM does not necessarily happen during each sleep cycle?

Now, Ted, don't make up your own stuff and blame it on me.

ChicagoGranny wrote:As a general rule, later in the night more time is spent in REM sleep.

In normal sleep, notice how the REM periods lengthen as the night proceeds:

ChicagoGranny · Post by **ChicagoGranny** » Mon Dec 05, 2016 4:06 pm

BTW, it is common for a sleep-deprived person to fall quickly into REM sleep and have long periods of REM. This will return to normal after the person becomes well rested.

rick blaine · Post by **rick blaine** » Mon Dec 05, 2016 4:07 pm

tedtomato asks: "Is this usual?"

In times gone by, it was. See here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-16964783

You might even ask: where did we get the idea of eight hours uninterrupted?

When I started on APAP six years ago, and was still getting used to it, two hours on the machine was 'a good sleep'. Those two hours were more restful than what I'd been getting before - so I called that a result.

Over time - about four months - I built up to an average of six hours a night. But this year, I, too, have been waking up after four hours. And it's quite-fully awake, not 'reach-for-the-snooze-button, still sleepy'.

And I've taken a leaf out of those history books - I get up, have some tea, read, etc. And then 90 minutes later, I go back to bed for another two or three hours. With my mask on and the machine running.

Seems to me that's the important bit - not waking up or having split nights, but always using the equipment.

PS. You asked about sleep cycles. The BBC magazine page I linked to above also gives a concise summary.

avi123 · Post by **avi123** » Mon Dec 05, 2016 4:19 pm

tedtomato wrote:Hi,

I have been on CPAP for only a few weeks, and I am still getting used to it.

I have noticed over the last few nights that I tend to go to sleep fairly quickly now (while it was a struggle when I started CPAP) but only stay asleep for 3 or 4 hours. I therefore wake up at 1am or 2am, quite refreshed and feeling well. However, I struggle to go back to sleep with the mask and machine on, so I go back to sleep without CPAP, and wake up more tired.

Is this usual?

I am assuming 3 or 4 hours is matching a sleep cycle?

T.

During the last year I managed to increase my sleep time from 5 to 6.5 hours non- stop. I go to sleep at midnight and watch TV in bed until 1 a.m. Then I put the mask on, start the CPAP and fall asleep till 7:30. If I wake before 6 a.m., I then wash my eyes and rinse my mouth with faucet water and go back to sleep with the CPAP till 7:30. I don't know if I have REMs because I don't remember any dreams. My last sleep study was 6 years ago.

SewTired · Post by **SewTired** » Tue Dec 06, 2016 10:39 pm

tedtomato wrote:Hi,

I have been on CPAP for only a few weeks, and I am still getting used to it.

I have noticed over the last few nights that I tend to go to sleep fairly quickly now (while it was a struggle when I started CPAP) but only stay asleep for 3 or 4 hours. I therefore wake up at 1am or 2am, quite refreshed and feeling well. However, I struggle to go back to sleep with the mask and machine on, so I go back to sleep without CPAP, and wake up more tired.

This is not at all unusual. I find it helps to get up, walk around a bit. Go back to bed and turn on my ocean waves and the little fan on my face. I'm typically out again in 15 minutes. I don't know why the fan helps at 2 a.m. but it does. I think I just get overheated with a blanket. If I DO NOT have the mask on for that 2-6 a.m. slot, I am dragging all day although not necessarily sleepy.

Sleeping only 3 or 4 hours with CPAP

Sleeping only 3 or 4 hours with CPAP

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