Mouth-breathing questions

Hi. I'm trying to use my cpap equipment, and been reasonably successful in the past 3 weeks. I'm taking a break now, though, because I've developed a dry cough and I want to see if it goes away if I stop for awhile.

I wanted to ask about the nose-cone mask - specifically, F&P Eson. I'd been using a Liberty that covered my mouth and had pillow plugs in my nose, but found I couldn't wear it tight enough to keep air from blowing in my eyes. I notice with the Eson, that my mouth keeps wanting to open. My readings in the morning are fine, with AHI under 5.0, and leaks minimal, about 0.6. I'm hoping I can convince my mouth to stop opening now that I've got enough air going in thru my nose. Does that actually happen? Do people "learn" to stop breathing thru their mouths after awhile? If so, how long does it take? I'm half waking every time my mouth opens a crack and that's disturbing my sleep. Also, I tried a chin strap on, but found it would have to be extremely tight in order for it to hold my jaw closed. I can't tolerate anything tight pressing on my scalp so I didn't get a strap. But I wanted to ask if the chin strap doesn't have to be too tight and acts only as a reminder that the mouth's to stay close. Is that how it's supposed to work?

I'd appreciate information from those who've been thru what I'm experiencing. I don't seem to need much more than 8.2 pressure (Resmed S8 Elite II), and I've got my humidifier (H4i) set at 3.5 (which is somewhat wet).

I've tried numerous masks over the past few years and never managed to be successfully compliant because I found the whole apparatus quite uncomfortable and I'm a light sleeper. I was diagnosed in 2009 with mild apnea and told I only needed CPAP if I wanted to use it. But I can't sleep on my back without my tongue blocking my airway, and I haven't been feeling rested for sometime when I wake, so I thought I'd try once more to adapt to the equipment. I'm new to the Eson and so far it seems to be the best mask as far as comfort is concerned.

Any advice, or tips from more experienced users?

benzmum wrote:Hi. I'm trying to use my cpap equipment, and been reasonably successful in the past 3 weeks. I'm taking a break now, though, because I've developed a dry cough and I want to see if it goes away if I stop for awhile.

I wanted to ask about the nose-cone mask - specifically, F&P Eson. I'd been using a Liberty that covered my mouth and had pillow plugs in my nose, but found I couldn't wear it tight enough to keep air from blowing in my eyes. I notice with the Eson, that my mouth keeps wanting to open. My readings in the morning are fine, with AHI under 5.0, and leaks minimal, about 0.6. I'm hoping I can convince my mouth to stop opening now that I've got enough air going in thru my nose. Does that actually happen? Do people "learn" to stop breathing thru their mouths after awhile? If so, how long does it take? I'm half waking every time my mouth opens a crack and that's disturbing my sleep. Also, I tried a chin strap on, but found it would have to be extremely tight in order for it to hold my jaw closed. I can't tolerate anything tight pressing on my scalp so I didn't get a strap. But I wanted to ask if the chin strap doesn't have to be too tight and acts only as a reminder that the mouth's to stay close. Is that how it's supposed to work?

I'd appreciate information from those who've been thru what I'm experiencing. I don't seem to need much more than 8.2 pressure (Resmed S8 Elite II), and I've got my humidifier (H4i) set at 3.5 (which is somewhat wet).

I've tried numerous masks over the past few years and never managed to be successfully compliant because I found the whole apparatus quite uncomfortable and I'm a light sleeper. I was diagnosed in 2009 with mild apnea and told I only needed CPAP if I wanted to use it. But I can't sleep on my back without my tongue blocking my airway, and I haven't been feeling rested for sometime when I wake, so I thought I'd try once more to adapt to the equipment. I'm new to the Eson and so far it seems to be the best mask as far as comfort is concerned.

Any advice, or tips from more experienced users?

I don't think I have any advice on the mask issues, but are you taking Lisinopril? (for blood pressure or Diabetes)
It is a known "dry cough" contributor and if so, ask your doctor to switch you to something else......like Diovan/Valsartan or Cozaar/Losartan.

Edit: Have you experimented with lowering your humidifier setting? For some people, too much warm humid air can cause congestion and then contribute to mouth-breathing.
Doing nasal cleansing before bedtime?


Den

.

Why are you struggling to back sleep - it's the most event provoking position there is and most of us work hard at not doing it.

benzmum wrote:Hi. I'm trying to use my cpap equipment, and been reasonably successful in the past 3 weeks. I'm taking a break now, though, because I've developed a dry cough and I want to see if it goes away if I stop for awhile.

I wanted to ask about the nose-cone mask - specifically, F&P Eson. I'd been using a Liberty that covered my mouth and had pillow plugs in my nose, but found I couldn't wear it tight enough to keep air from blowing in my eyes. I notice with the Eson, that my mouth keeps wanting to open. My readings in the morning are fine, with AHI under 5.0, and leaks minimal, about 0.6. I'm hoping I can convince my mouth to stop opening now that I've got enough air going in thru my nose. Does that actually happen? Do people "learn" to stop breathing thru their mouths after awhile? If so, how long does it take? I'm half waking every time my mouth opens a crack and that's disturbing my sleep. Also, I tried a chin strap on, but found it would have to be extremely tight in order for it to hold my jaw closed. I can't tolerate anything tight pressing on my scalp so I didn't get a strap. But I wanted to ask if the chin strap doesn't have to be too tight and acts only as a reminder that the mouth's to stay close. Is that how it's supposed to work?

I'd appreciate information from those who've been thru what I'm experiencing. I don't seem to need much more than 8.2 pressure (Resmed S8 Elite II), and I've got my humidifier (H4i) set at 3.5 (which is somewhat wet).

I've tried numerous masks over the past few years and never managed to be successfully compliant because I found the whole apparatus quite uncomfortable and I'm a light sleeper. I was diagnosed in 2009 with mild apnea and told I only needed CPAP if I wanted to use it. But I can't sleep on my back without my tongue blocking my airway, and I haven't been feeling rested for sometime when I wake, so I thought I'd try once more to adapt to the equipment. I'm new to the Eson and so far it seems to be the best mask as far as comfort is concerned.

Any advice, or tips from more experienced users?

This is the exact reason for NOT sleeping on your back.

benzmum wrote:leaks minimal, about 0.6.

benzmum wrote:(Resmed S8 Elite II)

Actually that leak number isn't minimal when coming from a S8 machine.
It would be minimal if reported from a S9 machine.
S8 machine report leaks in Liters per second...S9 reports in Liters per minute.
To convert your S8 liters per second to liters per minute you need to multiply by 60 seconds...so that means the 0.6 is 36 L/min...and way above the 24 Liters per minute ResMed says is the red line for beginning of large leak territory.
Now it is a 95% number which means at OR below that number and not where it was at all night but without seeing the leak graph we don't know just how much time you spent above 24 L/min. Maybe it was an hour...maybe it was 4 hours...we just don't know.
Without seeing the graphs we have to assume the worst though. Leaks are potentially big enough to impact that AHI meaning at over 30 L/min the machine might be missing events because it can't sense them and that low AHI might not be accurate.

If you want to breathe through your nose instead of your mouth, practice, practice, practice. It's as beneficial to breathe through your nose when awake as it is when you're asleep. You can't consciously control what you do when you're asleep, but you can when you're awake. Also, try to train your tongue to stay at the top of your mouth, forming a barrier, so even if you do open your mouth you shouldn't have as much air leakage. It's not easy to reverse the habits of a lifetime, but it can be done.

Another thing I found useful, besides the usual tip of using nasal saline spray, is chewing mint sugarless gum just before sleeping. I find it helps open my nasal passage as well as helping to keep my mouth moist.

Very off topic but gotta ask.

How does wearing a nasal mask work when you have a cold? Seems that it could help or hurt...don't know which.

Wulfman... wrote:
I don't think I have any advice on the mask issues, but are you taking Lisinopril? (for blood pressure or Diabetes)
It is a known "dry cough" contributor and if so, ask your doctor to switch you to something else......like Diovan/Valsartan or Cozaar/Losartan.



Den

This is good to know. I do take Lisinopril for blood pressure and in fact, it was just increased and I've noticed a dry cough. I'm going to ask my Doc about it the next time I see him. I hate to make an appointment just for a cough so I'm giving it time to see if it's allergies or something but I think you might be onto something there.

JimP wrote:Very off topic but gotta ask.

How does wearing a nasal mask work when you have a cold? Seems that it could help or hurt...don't know which.

I've never been able to use a FFM long-term. So, I've been stuck using a chin strap and nasal mask. I am trying out the Eson as we speak. 3 days now and counting. I hear some people train their mouth to stay shut. But mine opens from time to time even with the chin strap. Not much I can do about it but make the effort. I use the Sullivan strap and usually buy them from cpap.com It works better for me than the Respironics chin strap. But your mileage may vary.

I find that my nasal mask helps kind've blast through a cold. Before PAP I would mostly mouth breath and I couldn't breath through my nose anywhere near as well as I do now. I have slotted nares for one and probably a deviated septum although I'm not positive on that. I've never had a night where I was too sick to use my nasal masks. And I usually get colds last in my family. The wife and kids get them first and If I get them, I get them last.

I will second the Lisinopril dry cough from experience several years ago and it was very irritating. I thought I would never stop coughing. So you might want to check on what Den said about the other meds. It is a pretty common side effect of this medicine. My husband also had the cough with it until our meds were switched. But I also had a dry cough with my cpap tx and had to play with my humidity. At this time I am only using pass over air after using Ayr nasal saline gel inside my nostrils at night. The cough is gone but I still feel like I need to clear my throat sometimes.

From:

http://www.drugs.com/lisinopril.html

Lisinopril side effects

Get emergency medical help if you have any of these signs of an allergic reaction to lisinopril: hives; severe stomach pain, difficult breathing; swelling of your face, lips, tongue, or throat.

Call your doctor at once if you have:

a light-headed feeling, like you might pass out;

little or no urinating;

swelling, rapid weight gain;

fever, chills, body aches, flu symptoms;

tired feeling, muscle weakness, and pounding or uneven heartbeats;

psoriasis (raised, silvery flaking of the skin);

chest pain; or

high potassium (slow heart rate, weak pulse, muscle weakness, tingly feeling);

Common lisinopril side effects may include:

cough;

dizziness, drowsiness, headache;

depressed mood;

nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, upset stomach; or

mild skin itching or rash.

This is not a complete list of side effects and others may occur. Call your doctor for medical advice about side effects.


Den

.

Thanks everyone! I'll keep this short because I keep losing my post.... I don't use bp meds - had a flu, actually. Now back at it with cpap but this morning I had an angry looking stripe on the right side of my nose, where the Eson seal would sit. anyone experienced this? Haven't seen it before; it's settled down, though still somewhat visible.

Thanks for the leak info - I'll watch that carefully.