Attn: whiners, complainers, quitters

At the risk of getting flamed (actually I am sure I will be ) why is it a cardinal sin to quit cpap? Yeah, the person might die or ruin their health but this forum isn't responsible for the choices that someone makes. After all, this is the wild west where individual freedom is king or queen from my point of view.

All jokes aside, I thank my lucky stars every day that when I tapered of off 4 psych meds after 15 years of use that I had access to a board that initially had a completely opposite point of view from this one. Otherwise, I would have never have gotten off those meds. And when it started moving in this direction, thankfully, another one emerged to provide the necessary support to vulnerable people.

Finally, I would like to ask a question to folks and maybe it should be another poll question. How long should someone stay on pap therapy before deciding it isn't going to work and moving on to other methods to be exempt from the quitter designation. 6 months, a year, two years, 5 years, 10 years?

49er

Good point, 49er. My cpap success was immediate and significant,
probably because my apnea was a simple, "textbook" case.
Probably the only "normal" thing about me.
Too few doctors look beyond the obvious and really delve for the difficult answer.
Hugh Laurie's character would get a real workout.

Wulfman... wrote:After all, we're here to try to help people get used to this therapy, and if it looks like they need the "tough love" approach, they may get it.
On the other hand, if they sincerely ask for help with just about anything, they'll get the "kid gloves" approach.
Den

I certainly came here w/the "please help, I'm grateful for any help....and sympathy."

After asking the same question over and over, because my brain was
too fried to realize the answer was right in front of me......
the green rubber man wacked me upside the head w/the 2X4....
and my eyes popped open.

In a blink of rage at him, I realized how bad it was.....
and got down to making this work.
A life changing moment for me.

49er wrote:At the risk of getting flamed (actually I am sure I will be ) why is it a cardinal sin to quit cpap? Yeah, the person might die or ruin their health but this forum isn't responsible for the choices that someone makes. After all, this is the wild west where individual freedom is king or queen from my point of view.

I think the main problem that many of us react to are the posters who insist on obtaining our blessing for quitting CPAP and some of them want our blessing for quitting CPAP before they've even tried to become compliant. And since this is a blog whose primary purpose is helping people successfully adjust to CPAP, these posts are, indeed, frequently responded to in ways that make the original poster of the thread feel all too unwelcome.

But----I know that back during my dark, dark days of a very difficult adjustment period, there were long time posters who sincerely encouraged me to consider giving myself a small break from CPAP and/or looking into an oral appliance to treat my moderate OSA---particularly after this was also suggested by my then PA. (However, my TMJ specialist, who also does oral appliances for OSA, urged me to NOT go the oral appliance route because of the severe TMJ problems.)

Finally, I would like to ask a question to folks and maybe it should be another poll question. How long should someone stay on pap therapy before deciding it isn't going to work and moving on to other methods to be exempt from the quitter designation. 6 months, a year, two years, 5 years, 10 years?

Quitting is in the eye of the beholder. As someone who had a very difficult adjustment period AND as someone who still is struggling with insomnia problems that exploded after I started CPAP, this is a question that I've asked myself a lot over the last 4 1/2 years.

There is no one right answer. But there are a lot of wrong answers this question. And the same answer might be "right" for one person and "wrong" for another. Specifically, a lot of the "right vs wrong" comes down to a mixture of all of the following things when answering this question: How bad is the person's OSA? How bad are the untreated OSA symptoms? Are other comorbidities already present? How hard has the person actually tried? Has the person been willing to actually gather data on how difficult their CPAP experience is and what they've tried to do? Has the person taken the time to try to figure out what their problems with CPAP actually are? Or do they reject out-of-hand any and all suggestions on how to get over their current problems? Are their proposed alternatives realistic or are they pie-in-the-sky or outright snake oil?

OSA is like many other chronic diseases: It can take time to sort out the standard therapy and the long term toll on the body can be significant. And many folks living with other chronic diseases, such as HBP, glaucoma, and diabetes do struggle to stay "compliant" with their prescribed medications. But one big difference between treating OSA and treating something like HBP, glaucoma, or diabetes is the lack of genuinely effective treatments beyond PAP: If a person has a bad reaction to a particular HBP medication, there's always something else that can be prescribed. That's not so true with OSA.

wrote: How long should someone stay on pap therapy before deciding it isn't going to work and moving on to other methods to be exempt from the quitter designation. 6 months, a year, two years, 5 years, 10 years?

Quit using CPAP? Then why not go quietly into the dark and leave people alone on this forum? It is a CPAP forum, you know?

49er wrote:
Finally, I would like to ask a question to folks and maybe it should be another poll question. How long should someone stay on pap therapy before deciding it isn't going to work and moving on to other methods to be exempt from the quitter designation. 6 months, a year, two years, 5 years, 10 years?

49er

It seems that one answer would be to use a daily log to track your total progress. When you see benefits from xPAP declining as evidenced by the data readouts you may then start thinking about moving on. The other thing to think about is what can you do to find a replacement therapy.

The question is why isn't xPAP therapy working? and what therapy would work better? and finally what can I use to measure the alternative therapy to see that it is an improvement.

HoseCrusher wrote:

49er wrote:
Finally, I would like to ask a question to folks and maybe it should be another poll question. How long should someone stay on pap therapy before deciding it isn't going to work and moving on to other methods to be exempt from the quitter designation. 6 months, a year, two years, 5 years, 10 years?

49er

It seems that one answer would be to use a daily log to track your total progress. When you see benefits from xPAP declining as evidenced by the data readouts you may then start thinking about moving on. The other thing to think about is what can you do to find a replacement therapy.

The question is why isn't xPAP therapy working? and what therapy would work better? and finally what can I use to measure the alternative therapy to see that it is an improvement.

Well said HoseCrusher!

Cereal Killer wrote:

wrote: How long should someone stay on pap therapy before deciding it isn't going to work and moving on to other methods to be exempt from the quitter designation. 6 months, a year, two years, 5 years, 10 years?

Quit using CPAP? Then why not go quietly into the dark and leave people alone on this forum? It is a CPAP forum, you know?

So true, if you want to die younger than you should, it's your choice, natural selection.... The world has way too many people in it, give it a break. Acording to t.v. ad's, the cost of funerals has went up $ 3,000 in this year, cut future costs go early. SS won't even pay for filling the hole. ($225).

Posting that kind of crap here, only serves to push someone that is on the fence off, onto the it's OK, to quit trying side (on the rocks). Do others a favor, go off in the woods and lie down like animals do. I do know your motivation, misery loves company, so naturally you want to spread it around.

It's a lot easier than to do the responsible thing of making XPAP work for you.
Welcome to the "I can't club, you are a honorary short lifetime member."

All I ask is, stop trying to push others to fail like you, go into the woods alone, soon they will be nice and green. Jim

When I think of the hodge podge of personalities here, I can't help but think how hard this environment is for verbal processors. The verbal processor talks through the points in their decision making. Or in this case, writes. Rarely does the first thing out of their mouth even resemble their conclusion. They may be seen as wavering or wishy-washy, like they change their minds a lot. Not so. The outsider just happens to be privy to the thought processes in this type of personality. When this person makes a statement while simply weighing their pros and cons, they may suddenly find themselves in the position of defending or at least explaining something that was never intended to be a conclusion. However, they may not even realize what has just happened and can get stuck in the middle of the decision making process on points that were never really points, thus hindering arriving at thoroughly thought out conclusions. A person's initial resistance to sound advice may be just them thinking things through. Time will tell.

When I first came here I was quite fragile. I needed to be supported until I was strong enough to support myself. Not coddled. Supported. Big difference. We make replies on here every day not knowing the stability of the poster. Actually, the most problematic poster is likely in the greatest need. I'm all for tough love, but where is the love in character assassination, labeling and berating? I interpret tough love to be direct, fact based, and measured. Challenging. No sugar-coating. People who can do that yet leave the core dignity of the listener as a fellow human being intact are priceless. I admire those who use their words so skillfully. They can cut through the fog and the mess and excuses and help an indecisive or overwhelmed person cut straight to the chase. I've needed that more than a few times in life, as in the past I was the queen of excuses and denial. I think it became a survival mechanism for when reality was just so hard to face head on. There's a place for all the different kinds of support. Not knowing the posters, I tend to err on the side of caution. I'd rather be thought a push-over than push someone over the edge. Just my personal bent based on a past that would read like a crime drama. But gee, everyone has a story. We truly never fully know what others are going through.

kteague wrote: We make replies on here every day not knowing the stability of the poster. Actually, the most problematic poster is likely in the greatest need. I'm all for tough love, but where is the love in character assassination, labeling and berating? I interpret tough love to be direct, fact based, and measured. Challenging. No sugar-coating. People who can do that yet leave the core dignity of the listener as a fellow human being intact are priceless... We truly never fully know what others are going through.

Words of gold. Thank you.

I admire those who use their words so skillfully.

As you have done in your post Kathy. I admire your writing -- there is always wisdom and compassion in what you say.

Nailed it kteague

It must be nice to know it all

Gee whiz... my "hidden talents" have been discovered.

At the risk of getting flamed (actually I am sure I will be ) why is it a cardinal sin to quit cpap? Yeah, the person might die or ruin their health but this forum isn't responsible for the choices that someone makes. After all, this is the wild west where individual freedom is king or queen from my point of view.

Bad thing about quitting for some of us is that we would become even more miserable; death would not come immediately and mercifully. I feel like I'm stuck in a horrible place; I hate everyday with this condition, but I am scared of death too. I have to endure this.

I really like those who come here for help and then angrily turn down all suggestions, and refuse to even try anything. They can't even be bothered to download Sleepyhead to check their data.

Why are they wasting everyone's time? Sometimes it takes a couple days to identify them. Then they can be ignored, but in the meantime they waste a lot of bandwidth.