Another clue

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
glowradar
Posts: 27
Joined: Mon Mar 23, 2015 8:18 am

Another clue

Post by glowradar » Fri Mar 27, 2015 8:00 am

I have noticed when sleeping on my side my nose gets clogged. Last night I was sleeping great, and then around 3:30 I switched to my side. At around 5 I awoke with clear signs of apnea: my heart was pounding, and my nasal passages were clogged making the nasal mask almost useless. As soon as I rolled to my back it went away, but I nearly got back to sleep.
What is that about?

_________________
Machine: ResMed AirSense™ 10 AutoSet™ CPAP Machine with HumidAir™ Heated Humidifier
Mask: AirFit™ F10 Full Face Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: Software: Sleepyhead 0.9.8-1
Diagnosed: 12/31/2014
First CPAP day: 3/3/2015

glowradar
Posts: 27
Joined: Mon Mar 23, 2015 8:18 am

Re: Another clue

Post by glowradar » Fri Mar 27, 2015 8:04 am

Can allergens get through the air filter? Seems unlikely. And why only on my side?

_________________
Machine: ResMed AirSense™ 10 AutoSet™ CPAP Machine with HumidAir™ Heated Humidifier
Mask: AirFit™ F10 Full Face Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: Software: Sleepyhead 0.9.8-1
Diagnosed: 12/31/2014
First CPAP day: 3/3/2015

dazza
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2015 2:47 am

Re: Another clue

Post by dazza » Fri Mar 27, 2015 8:23 am

I seem to have exactly the same problem,,maybe it has something to do with not having the humidifier settings set right.I seem to have times where my respiratory rate increases through the night like im trying to get air in through the congestion.I also suffer from allergies.Maybe the gurus on here will help with an answer.

_________________
MachineMask

User avatar
Pugsy
Posts: 63941
Joined: Thu May 14, 2009 9:31 am
Location: Missouri, USA

Re: Another clue

Post by Pugsy » Fri Mar 27, 2015 8:37 am

Probably you are experiencing some nasal cycle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nasal_cycle
It's very common when we have a cold...the side that is down seems to really get clogged up and we turn over and before long the new side that is down gets clogged up.

But it can happen even if we don't have a cold.

I don't know how to prevent of fix it.

When changing something (position or whatever) offers pretty much instantaneous improvement I doubt it is allergy related or humidity related. Both of those typical problems wouldn't abate instantly with just a change in position. They take time to have the nasal mucosa adjust when congestion is allergy or humidity related because the nasal mucosa don't typical reduce marked swelling caused by the histamine response (which causes the mucosa to swell and that causes the congestion) in just 5 or 10 seconds.

The only other possibility that really doesn't sound like it could be a possible culprit in your case, is mask pressure on the outer nasal area where the turbinates are...sometimes it only takes a tiny bit of pressure in that area (along the nasal bridge) to cause congestion and when the pressure is removed the relief from the congestion is pretty much immediate. Your mask doesn't touch that area though.
I have this problem myself and that's one of the main reasons I don't use any mask that touches my nasal bridge area which pretty much limits me to nasal pillows.

_________________
Machine: AirCurve™ 10 VAuto BiLevel Machine with HumidAir™ Heated Humidifier
Additional Comments: Mask Bleep Eclipse https://bleepsleep.com/the-eclipse/
I may have to RISE but I refuse to SHINE.

If you want to try the Eclipse mask and want a special promo code to get a little off the price...send me a private message.

Nyre
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu Mar 12, 2015 1:31 am
Location: New Castle, Indiana

Re: Another clue

Post by Nyre » Fri Mar 27, 2015 8:40 am

When you sleep on your side all your nasal fluids drain to the one side and will cause congestion. I have this problem too and without starting on xpap therapy yet so I can't exclude that it is caused by pap therapy

glowradar
Posts: 27
Joined: Mon Mar 23, 2015 8:18 am

Re: Another clue

Post by glowradar » Fri Mar 27, 2015 8:56 am

Thanks Pugsy. I had noticed this symptom before CPAP. I had assumed it was allergies, or would go away with CPAP, but obviously thats not the case.

One distinct possibility: vasomotor rhinitis
http://www.entnet.org/content/stuffy-nose
http://www.healthline.com/health/vasomo ... Treatment5

The blood vessels get enlarged when you lie on your side!!

My ENT suggested a saline spray a while ago, and when I used it there was noticeable improvement in nightime nasal congestion, but it didn't always work, and I stopped using it after I got the CPAP because I wanted to see what impact the CPAP had. My best sleep in years was the night before last - but I was on my back the whole time.

I read another site that suggested a steroid spray for two weeks and see what that does. The steroid sprays are considered more effective than saline or antihistamines, but they used to require a prescription. They sell steroid sprays OTC now - Walgreens sells Flonase - I think I'll try it tonight and see what happens.

I'm 44 years old, light drinker, non-smoker, who exercises 4x a week, so I've been mystified (as have the doctors) that the apnea is so severe. Several have commented on the post nasal drip visible upon exam. Maybe I'm zeroing in on the real culprit: I have varicose veins in my nose. How attractive!

One of the really nice things about all the data from the CPAP is it has allowed me to empirically evaluate whats going on instead of just guessing.

_________________
Machine: ResMed AirSense™ 10 AutoSet™ CPAP Machine with HumidAir™ Heated Humidifier
Mask: AirFit™ F10 Full Face Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: Software: Sleepyhead 0.9.8-1
Diagnosed: 12/31/2014
First CPAP day: 3/3/2015

User avatar
Pugsy
Posts: 63941
Joined: Thu May 14, 2009 9:31 am
Location: Missouri, USA

Re: Another clue

Post by Pugsy » Fri Mar 27, 2015 9:15 am

glowradar wrote:I have varicose veins in my nose. How attractive!
You know I had never really thought of it that way but you are right...that's sort of what it is.

If it were me I would probably try the OTC steroid and see if that helped (along with regular use of something like Simply Saline).
I have experienced this nasal cycle thing but not very frequently (unless I have a cold then I know the cold is the reason) so I never really had the need to start trying to do something to prevent it on a regular basis.
For me it's rare and I usually just turn over to the other side and go back to sleep and that's the end of it. Once in a night and maybe once in a month at that.

_________________
Machine: AirCurve™ 10 VAuto BiLevel Machine with HumidAir™ Heated Humidifier
Additional Comments: Mask Bleep Eclipse https://bleepsleep.com/the-eclipse/
I may have to RISE but I refuse to SHINE.

If you want to try the Eclipse mask and want a special promo code to get a little off the price...send me a private message.

User avatar
Nick Danger
Posts: 621
Joined: Mon Jun 09, 2014 3:13 pm

Re: Another clue

Post by Nick Danger » Fri Mar 27, 2015 9:31 am

I had this problem all the time when I had a deviated septum. I haven't noticed it at all since the septoplasty.

_________________
Machine: ResMed AirSense™ 10 AutoSet™ CPAP Machine with HumidAir™ Heated Humidifier
Mask: AirFit™ P10 Nasal Pillow CPAP Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: APAP mode, minimum pressure = 9. No ramp, EPR = 3, medium. Soft cervical collar. Sleepyhead software.

glowradar
Posts: 27
Joined: Mon Mar 23, 2015 8:18 am

Re: Another clue

Post by glowradar » Fri Mar 27, 2015 10:06 am

Is a deviated septum visible in a physical exam, or does it require a scan? I've had a couple people shine lights up my nose and no one has mentioned a deviated septum.

_________________
Machine: ResMed AirSense™ 10 AutoSet™ CPAP Machine with HumidAir™ Heated Humidifier
Mask: AirFit™ F10 Full Face Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: Software: Sleepyhead 0.9.8-1
Diagnosed: 12/31/2014
First CPAP day: 3/3/2015

User avatar
Pugsy
Posts: 63941
Joined: Thu May 14, 2009 9:31 am
Location: Missouri, USA

Re: Another clue

Post by Pugsy » Fri Mar 27, 2015 10:10 am

I think a deviated septum is usually easily visible just by looking up the nose and sometimes don't even have to look up the nose if it is badly damaged (fist to nose type of thing )
Usually deviated septum issues aren't so sporadic if solely related to deviation or lack of but it could possibly accentuate other possible issues.

_________________
Machine: AirCurve™ 10 VAuto BiLevel Machine with HumidAir™ Heated Humidifier
Additional Comments: Mask Bleep Eclipse https://bleepsleep.com/the-eclipse/
I may have to RISE but I refuse to SHINE.

If you want to try the Eclipse mask and want a special promo code to get a little off the price...send me a private message.

User avatar
palerider
Posts: 32300
Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 5:43 pm
Location: Dallas(ish).

Re: Another clue

Post by palerider » Fri Mar 27, 2015 10:33 am

glowradar wrote:Can allergens get through the air filter? Seems unlikely. And why only on my side?
depends, are you using the standard filter, or the hypoallergenic one?

standard:
Material: Polyester non woven fiber
Average arrestance: >75% for ~7 micron dust

hypoallergenic:
Material: Acrylic and polypropylene fibers in a polypropylene carrier
Efficiency: >98% for ~7-8 micron dust; >80% for ~0.5 micron dust

_________________
Mask: Bleep DreamPort CPAP Mask Solution
Additional Comments: S9 VPAP Auto
Get OSCAR

Accounts to put on the foe list: dataq1, clownbell, gearchange, lynninnj, mper!?, DreamDiver, Geer1, almostadoctor, sleepgeek, ajack, stom, mogy, D.H., They often post misleading, timewasting stuff.

glowradar
Posts: 27
Joined: Mon Mar 23, 2015 8:18 am

Re: Another clue

Post by glowradar » Fri Mar 27, 2015 12:35 pm

Palerider, very interesting. I have no idea. Whatever came with the machine... I'm only 3 weeks in, so I have a lot to learn. Who knew there was so many twists to this whole thing?

_________________
Machine: ResMed AirSense™ 10 AutoSet™ CPAP Machine with HumidAir™ Heated Humidifier
Mask: AirFit™ F10 Full Face Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: Software: Sleepyhead 0.9.8-1
Diagnosed: 12/31/2014
First CPAP day: 3/3/2015

User avatar
palerider
Posts: 32300
Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 5:43 pm
Location: Dallas(ish).

Re: Another clue

Post by palerider » Fri Mar 27, 2015 4:55 pm

glowradar wrote:Palerider, very interesting. I have no idea. Whatever came with the machine... I'm only 3 weeks in, so I have a lot to learn. Who knew there was so many twists to this whole thing?
it's almost certain to be the standard filter.

cpap.com has six packs of the hypo filters for 12$ and I think I heard something recently about a free shipping code, (less on ebay) it looks like the as10 was cleverly designed to use the same filter as the s9, so you don't have to wait for a new filter style to get cheaper.

_________________
Mask: Bleep DreamPort CPAP Mask Solution
Additional Comments: S9 VPAP Auto
Get OSCAR

Accounts to put on the foe list: dataq1, clownbell, gearchange, lynninnj, mper!?, DreamDiver, Geer1, almostadoctor, sleepgeek, ajack, stom, mogy, D.H., They often post misleading, timewasting stuff.