Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
Mike_Romeo
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Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by Mike_Romeo » Tue Mar 03, 2015 3:53 pm

Hi All,

Just newly signed up, basically have a few issues and figured this would be a good place to ask while waiting to see a Dr. I'm a healthy enough 26 year old male, regular at gym, sensible weight, no health conditions.

As I was trying to get to sleep last night, every time I was about to drift off I was awakened suddenly back to alertness by the feeling of failing to breath/get any air, along with a temporary increased heart rate. This continued for several hours despite changing sleeping positions. Also note I can't seem to yawn fully, it begins fine but it never ends correctly and basically dies mid-yawn without accomplishing anything.

After a few hours of trying to get to sleep I was worried it could be something serious heart/airway related so took myself to A+E at 3am, had an ECG and examination, all seemed fine so was sent home and told to see GP in a few days if it persists. I got no sleep all night, and then spent all day in work really tired and trying to yawn but never achieving it.

Tonight I'm having the same issue. So from googling (dangerous, I know) it seems to fit in with sleep apnea, however it seems strange that I've never noticed any symptoms until attempting to sleep last night.

While I don't generally suffer from stress or anxiety, I did have an odd skin outbreak in recent weeks that caused me some anxiety while the doctors were trying to narrow it down and treat it.

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Julie
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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by Julie » Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:11 pm

Hi... Apnea does not usually show up when you're awake - in other words the only 'awareness' you'd have of it at those times would be sleepiness, brain fog, etc. etc... not breathing problems. It does sound to me like you have either some kind of anxiety, or else another physical problem, cardiac or not, that has little to do with apnea. And no, apnea does not normally just manifest over a very short time... much more often it's years (once patients look back at their lives). You might want to ask for a neurology consult.

Mike_Romeo
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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by Mike_Romeo » Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:16 pm

Hi Julie,

Thanks very much for your reply. I will admit I am a bit of a hypochondriac (specifically intertwined with the anxiety) so it's difficult for me to honestly answer my behaviour over the past few years as exhibiting symptoms. I've never before had any recurring issues getting to sleep or generally staying asleep. Frequent yawning and tiredness during the day wouldn't be unusual but I'd accept it as within normal levels given the nature of my job which sometimes involves unsociable hours.

From googling I keep arriving at it being apnea but yea, it literally has appeared one evening with the flick of a switch.

I am Noctuary

Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by I am Noctuary » Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:20 pm

Well, yes it can. It did for me. One day I woke up and felt like I hadn't slept at all. From then on its been fatigue city all my days.

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BlackSpinner
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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by BlackSpinner » Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:22 pm

Mike_Romeo wrote:Hi All,

As I was trying to get to sleep last night, every time I was about to drift off I was awakened suddenly back to alertness by the feeling of failing to breath/get any air, along with a temporary increased heart rate. This continued for several hours despite changing sleeping positions. .
Yes many people have sleep transition apneas. You mind causes them as you move from drowsing into real sleep it forgets to breathe. I have the same thing and I kept thinking I was having some sort of anxiety attack but then I learned about them I relaxed. As long as they are short they are not a problem.

Yes it can feel like sleep apnea comes on suddenly but what really happens is that as it gets worse your body stops being able to deal with it at a certain point.

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SteveGold
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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by SteveGold » Wed Mar 04, 2015 1:23 pm

Mike_Romeo wrote:
Tonight I'm having the same issue. So from googling (dangerous, I know) it seems to fit in with sleep apnea, however it seems strange that I've never noticed any symptoms until attempting to sleep last night.
In my case, my first clue was that I'd wake up suddenly choking for air. Not very often, but often enough that I started to wonder if it was happening through the night without me knowing it. I was 29 and otherwise healthy, and didn't consider myself a candidate for sleep apnea.

So there might be something there worth investigating further. I don't think symptoms come on suddenly, but as they gradually worsen they might hit a point where you suddenly notice them.

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Huh?
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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by Huh? » Wed Mar 04, 2015 3:03 pm

Mike_Romeo wrote: I don't generally suffer from stress or anxiety
Mike_Romeo wrote: I will admit I am a bit of a hypochondriac (specifically intertwined with the anxiety)
Contradictory?

In any case, anxiety is often a symptom of untreated sleep apnea. Treat the sleep apnea and the anxiety may resolve itself.

Mike_Romeo
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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by Mike_Romeo » Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:22 pm

Thanks for the replies.

I guess my statement was contradictory, I don't tend to stress about much other than health issues. Work, money, relationships etc I don't stress over, just health.

I got a better night's sleep last night, maybe just due to exhaustion and drifting off quickly, but the lack of being able to complete a yawn still remains

purple
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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by purple » Wed Mar 04, 2015 9:33 pm

A young healthy athletic person can have sleep apnea and not know it.

If you have good insurance. Go to a Cardiologist. Sooner. He can steer you after they do some tests. Like a stress test. Maybe some other tests. Then the cardiologist might or might now suggest your seeing a Sleep Apnea doctor.

Statistically, anxiety attacks are true heart problems, as opposed to emotional problems. However, and less statistically probable, could be some kind of endocrine issue, or other things. Just it is a matter of priority, and a solid test. A true heart attack of some kind might really hurt your quality of life. Or even end your life. Also it is a big help to use a solid test to eliminate heart as a possible issue, and it is emotionally satisfying to know the truth.

Sleep Apnea refers to a group of different causes. Many of us have Obstructive Sleep Apnea, which I now recognize I had going back to when it was so hard to get up when I was in high school. Other folks have Sleep Apnea from other causes than the Obstructive Sleep Apnea which is more about the way my body tissues grew, and are now. . On the other hand, a very high percentage of cardiac patients have Sleep Apnea, and Sleep Apnea treatment goes a long long way to improving their quality of life. Assisting in the treatment of their cardiac problems. Improving things like energy, being rested, if it creates a goal to get an individual to do treatment, better sex.

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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by yaconsult » Thu Mar 05, 2015 12:51 am

If you have severe apnea, as I do, then you might always wake up just when falling asleep because you can't breathe. You feel like you are always just on the edge of falling asleep but you keep waking up, often without realizing that that is what is happening. I had to endure this in January during the first half of my sleep study.

A good way to diagnose this yourself is to use a voice recorder or recording app on your phone. Start recording when you go to sleep. What you are listening for is whether or not you stop breathing. If you do, then you will hear gasping for breath and/or snorting afterwards. Snoring doesn't necessarily indicate a problem but when present it makes it even easier to detect the cessation of breathing.

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purple
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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by purple » Thu Mar 05, 2015 9:35 am

Sometimes, the first test to see if one has Sleep Apnea is to do an overnight test at home with a Recording Pulse Oximeter. This puts a little clip onto the finger overnight, showing what your Pulse Ox level is all night. If you have any incidents where you wake up feeling suffocated, you might note the time, for them to see exactly what was going on at the same time on the Pulse Ox. Overnight Pulse Oximeter may not show a true heart problem; First because the heart problem might not be manifesting that night, and secondly because your system might not ever let the Oxygen get real low, so they would recognize it is significant.

Some athletes can have "Heart Palpitations;" where the symptom is like the heart is like a washing machine out of round. This is an extremely dangerous, but highly treatable health problems. Heart Palpitations can flip a clot, leading to artery blockages (strokes or heart attacks, if the clot lands in a kidney -eyes). In the beginning, some individuals ignore as the Palpitation can go away on its on after a few seconds. I know my heart can miss beats, but not enough that the docs want to medicate it, yet. Or put in a pacemaker. A lot of people have hearts that miss a beat or so every so often, and that is typified as normal. That kind of heart best miss I can not feel, and the only way to know it happened is if one is hooked up to a machine. A missed beat is not what might be happening to you.

If you are a young person, you might realize that there are today, many treatments for heart problems, which can allow you to live an active enjoyable life. However a single serious incident with the cardio vascular system can really ruin your life, and cost you a lot of money.

I bet any insurance company would pop for an 'at home' "Recording Pulse Oximeter" test, as it is far cheaper than nearly any other test for Sleep Apnea problems, and allow them to decide whether it can be justified to go forward with more testing.

In general, If one has good health insurance, I say Cardiology (very soon) before Sleep Apnea doc.

Your situation is a good reason for public health care. If we screened everyone who has your symptoms, quickly, rather than intimidating them with huge dollar costs to discourage individuals from seeking treatment, then we could have more working people, living happy lives. Paying taxes, rather than disabled, living on meager Disability payments from Uncle Sugar.

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The Choker
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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by The Choker » Thu Mar 05, 2015 10:59 am

purple wrote:Your situation is a good reason for public health care. If we screened everyone who has your symptoms, quickly,
Maybe you can cite a country which has government health care that screens everyone with his symptoms quickly?
T.C.

SteveGold
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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by SteveGold » Thu Mar 05, 2015 11:12 am

The Choker wrote:
purple wrote:Your situation is a good reason for public health care. If we screened everyone who has your symptoms, quickly,
Maybe you can cite a country which has government health care that screens everyone with his symptoms quickly?
In Ontario, getting screened for CPAP is a matter of getting a referral from your GP (all GP visits are covered by the province). You can usually schedule a study within a few days of the referral and get your results within a month. The province covers all the study costs so there's no financial deterrent to getting yourself checked out.

There are some users fees in the system, but getting tested for this or that condition is usually quick and free.

borgready
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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by borgready » Thu Mar 05, 2015 12:10 pm

What was the skin rash and what did they give you as meds for it?

Are you on any medications now are recently in the past few months?

Certain medication will affect your breathing.

How well can you breath through your nose. I will assume you can't as you struggle for air as soon as you dose off. Do you have cold or sinus issues? Do you have allergies? These things can come on suddenly and prevent breathing though the nose and then that causes you to have to mouth breath which is usually a struggle untill you learn to adapt to it.

Check your vitamin d and see if it is low. Low vitamin d will effect how your sleep/breathing control mechanisms of the brain work.

Do you commonly have nightmare/bad or scary dreams?

Mike_Romeo
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Re: Does sleep apnea manifest suddenly?

Post by Mike_Romeo » Thu Mar 05, 2015 12:57 pm

What was the skin rash and what did they give you as meds for it?
I never really got a definitive answer. Saw three doctors over it, treated for ringworm, then scabies then my own usual doctor decided it looked like Pityriasis Rosea. I was on Prednisone for four days and it cleared up pretty well. Few weeks later, it still remained clear but my scalp has turned red.
Are you on any medications now are recently in the past few months?
A week's treatment with Datakort cream in January, Lyclear dermal cream to treat for scabies (really was a random shot in the dark rather than serious suspect) and then short burst of of Prednisone for four days. Together with Phenaghram anti-histamine to reduce the itch and help sleep at night.
Do you commonly have nightmare/bad or scary dreams?
Not particularly, certainly to no extent that it bothers me and I rarely remember dreams.


I'll try and experiment with some recording. Last night was a pretty shoddy night of sleep again, I'd desperately love a good night's sleep. Oddly though I haven't been suffering fatigue as much as I'd expect during the day though I do yawn, although not fully.

I explained my symptoms to another doctor today who suggested it's acute anxiety, 12x5mg Diazepam and Propanolol to see if it makes a difference.

Thanks for all your input, it's comforting to hear from others who have been in similar situations.