OT: Tragic Shooting.

[deltadave]

I appreciate the arguments. However, I am not convinced that video cameras and armed guards are not a good idea. How could someone not support a guard engaging the assailant when he shot the window out to gain entrance? A tactical protection method must be employed while the strategic plans are devised.

That is stoopid. This kid comes walking up to the building:



and even if you were able to get a guard who's a Team 6 Seal doing a little moonlighting instead of a Barney Fife clone (which is more likely the case) the outcome would have been no different because:

• These guys have far more firepower;
• The element of surprise; and
• They're on a suicide mission.

Combat isn't Rocket Science. It is simply that you bring more assets to bear than your opponent.

[deltadave]

Combat isn't Rocket Science. It is simply that you bring more assets to bear than your opponent.

But that does not mean a Dillon in every school. Hopefully, somebody with a brain will figure out that having thousands of bullets flying around is not better than having hundreds of bullets flying around.

The problem is "having bullets flying around".

[deltadave]

So what happened to this kid



when he was in first grade?

Another scary thought:

Where will the SHES kids be in 15 years?

[deltadave]

I agree that stopping hate is a worthy goal. How is that accomplished?

I don't know, but sign this petition while I think about it:

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petiti ... o/XrsSn2zG

BTW, did you sign the petition to get Vicki Soto the Medal of Freedom?

[123.Shawn T.W.]

49'er,

Many teachers already have training, (atleast out here) and many instructors would offer discounts for them if the needed it.

To prevent kids getting to the gun, the school staff (not just teachers) just has to wear the gun in a holster, preferably concealed.

----------------------

ChicagoGrammy,

Here is a recent case of a concealed carry person "helping" http://www.nwcn.com/news/oregon/183609901.html but ... Yes, he did pull his gun out, and showed the shooter in the Clackamas Mall!

[ChicagoGranny]

For example, in the Provence of Victoria with 4 million people, there were 7 firearms homicides in 1997 and 19 in 98 which isn't very statistically significant in light of all the population count.

.0005%

So your position is that 26 out of a population of 318 million is "even less" statistically significant?

.000008%

Then not to worry?

[ChicagoGranny]

Logic fail.

So we should allow drunk driving since only non alcoholics obey drunk driving laws.

So you think everyone who drives drunk is alcoholic?


Logic fail.

So we should allow drunk driving since only non alcoholics obey drunk driving laws.

"They" are allowed to buy, possess and consume alcohol. "They" are allowed to drive until they get caught and most of them are still allowed to drive after being caught. Is this what you are proposing?

You once told me you don't drink anymore.

[49er]

Logic fail.

So we should allow drunk driving since only non alcoholics obey drunk driving laws.

So you think everyone who drives drunk is alcoholic?


Logic fail.

So we should allow drunk driving since only non alcoholics obey drunk driving laws.

"They" are allowed to buy, possess and consume alcohol. "They" are allowed to drive until they get caught and most of them are still allowed to drive after being caught. Is this what you are proposing?

You once told me you don't drink anymore.

CG,

As your favorite politician once said, "there you go again" in misrepresenting what I state. Of course, I expected that.

I not sure where you got the idea that I drink. For years, I have rarely ever had one and haven't since I consumed one at a relative's wedding over a year ago.

I do eat too many sweets though, particularly chocolate:)

Flame away as I know you will do.

49er

[deltadave]

ChicagoGrammy,

Here is a recent case of a concealed carry person "helping" http://www.nwcn.com/news/oregon/183609901.html but ... Yes, he did pull his gun out, and showed the shooter in the Clackamas Mall!

Given the media accounts from SHES, "IMHO" we'll need the "Official Investigation Report" (yeah, like there is such a thing) before this case can be used as support to say More Guns Are Better.

Roberts sprayed bullets with an AR-15 semi-automatic rifle near the food court, killing Steve Forsyth, 45 of West Linn, and Cindy Yuille, 54 of Northeast Portland. Roberts seriously injured Kristina Shevchenko, a 15-year-old teen who lives in Southeast Portland with her family.

Roberts, 22, then walked down a hall and steps and shot himself to death, according to the Clackamas County Sheriff’s Office.

At 3:29 p.m. Dec. 11, Jacob Tyler Roberts, 22, of Southeast Portland, entered Clackamas Town Center through Macy's department store, walked into the food court and opened fire with a stolen AR-15 semiautomatic rifle. After randomly spraying dozens of shots at shoppers, unleashing pandemonium, Roberts ran down a corridor to a service stairway, where he shot himself.

Further, Meli hasn't gotten a lot of ink after the initial rush, and it may very well turn out he simply "froze up" (which is going to happen in the great majority of cases, unless the person is a nut to begin with).

[deltadave]

BTW, did you guys make and send your snowflakes yet?

[gomer]

I noticed several posters quoting STASTICS.

One interesting point was one quoted stats from a multi year period showing a decline in gun/violence while another showed a first year after gun ban. While I expect both are probably true, the comparing apples and oranges is NOT HONEST!

Here in the US states where common citizens are more likely to be armed, they are less likely to victims of crime, gun or otherwise.

Lets play devils advocate, You are a gunman looking to commit a crime. You are on a state line with a decision to make. DO I (the gunman) go to state A with a gun ban, or do I go to state Z where I am less likely to be defended against and risk my (the gunman's) own safety/life?

Stats for you posters who like them, says, the gunman will more likely go for the less risk to his/her own personal safety, and choose to commit the crime where they are less likely to be
confronted with arms.

Even if you personally do not carry or even like guns, the UN-armed citizen is safer in a society with guns. One problem tho is WHERE does society draw the LINE????

Q, Do we take away cars from safe drivers because DRUNK drivers maim & kill with them? (it is a fair question) SUV & pick up truck drivers tend to be bullies on the road, should we ban those vehicles?

[deltadave]

Q, Do we take away cars from safe drivers because DRUNK drivers maim & kill with them? (it is a fair question)

No, you take away the drunks' booze.

SUV & pick up truck drivers tend to be bullies on the road...

That is an unsubstantiated sterotype.

[Sleep2Die4]

President Obama has remained consistent with his rhetoric on "gun rights" and "gun control". This is from 2011 in Arizona and he repeated much of it, word for word, in two speeches this week. I am sure his speech writers did some copy and paste into the teleprompter.

"Now, like the majority of Americans, I believe that the Second Amendment guarantees an individual right to bear arms. And the courts have settled that as the law of the land. In this country, we have a strong tradition of gun ownership that's handed from generation to generation. Hunting and shooting are part of our nat
ional heritage. And, in fact, my administration has not curtailed the rights of gun owners - it has expanded them, including allowing people to carry their guns in national parks and wildlife refuges.

The fact is, almost all gun owners in America are highly responsible. They're our friends and neighbors. They buy their guns legally and use them safely, whether for hunting or target shooting, collection or protection. And that's something that gun-safety advocates need to accept." - President Obama

I don't think the anti-gun crowd are going to get what they want from this administration.

[Sleep2Die4]

Q, Do we take away cars from safe drivers because DRUNK drivers maim & kill with them? (it is a fair question)

No, you take away the drunks' booze.

Take away their hate.

[deltadave]

President Obama has remained consistent with his rhetoric on "gun rights" and "gun control". This is from 2011 in Arizona and he repeated much of it, word for word, in two speeches this week. I am sure his speech writers did some copy and paste into the teleprompter.

"Now, like the majority of Americans, I believe that the Second Amendment guarantees an individual right to bear arms. And the courts have settled that as the law of the land. In this country, we have a strong tradition of gun ownership that's handed from generation to generation. Hunting and shooting are part of our nat
ional heritage. And, in fact, my administration has not curtailed the rights of gun owners - it has expanded them, including allowing people to carry their guns in national parks and wildlife refuges.

The fact is, almost all gun owners in America are highly responsible. They're our friends and neighbors. They buy their guns legally and use them safely, whether for hunting or target shooting, collection or protection. And that's something that gun-safety advocates need to accept." - President Obama

I don't think the anti-gun crowd are going to get what they want from this administration.

That's old news already:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=p ... 5ynVMBxOus