So...can't wait till Friday

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
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Barb (Seattle)
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Barb (Seattle) » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:33 am

gwc2795 wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:06 am
Is the machine Jas_williams purchased for $150 an AVS machine? The reason I ask is -- I continue to have CA events and it is my understanding that an avs machine can treat them.

Please forgive me for hijacking barbs tread.
I just saw one onine for $150....$60 more if you want a cord. And, it was a used machine. No worries about hijacking :)
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Jas_williams
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Jas_williams » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:36 am

gwc2795 wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:06 am
Is the machine Jas_williams purchased for $150 an AVS machine? The reason I ask is -- I continue to have CA events and it is my understanding that an avs machine can treat them.

Please forgive me for hijacking barbs tread.
Yes this machine is an ASV it has no power supply, it does not have an auto adjusting epap that is fixed and set within the machine config you can set epap, min pressure support and max pressure support the machine does the rest.

It works great for me ONCE I got used to the pressure changes. Sleeping with an ASV can be challenging as the machine forces a breath on you !!!! Just as your about to fall asleep :roll:


Jason

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Pugsy
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Pugsy » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:42 am

gwc2795 wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:06 am
Is the machine Jas_williams purchased for $150 an AVS machine? The reason I ask is -- I continue to have CA events and it is my understanding that an avs machine can treat them.
Yes...it would qualify for the term ASV or NIV (non invasive ventilator) and can do what is needed to deal with central apnea.

In the ResMed model line the AirCurve 10 ASV model is the latest model but the S9 Adapt is just the big older brother of the AirCurve 10 ASV.
Only with the Adapt you don't see the term "ASV" on the outside of the machine...you see "Adapt".
The ASV term is seen inside in the clinical menu setup area though.
There are 2 S9 Adapt models....the 36007 and the 36037.
The 36007 is the older of the 2 models and only has one ASV mode choice in the menu with fixed EPAP...the 36037 had 2 different ASV modes in the menu. One has a fixed EPAP and one has an auto adjustable EPAP as part of the ASV mode.
The AirCurve 10 ASV...essentially a 36037 in terms of available modes and function just in a new package.
I think that they all have cpap mode available but it's not the same cpap mode as a person might have on one of the other models (Elite, AutoSet or even the regular AirCurve) because it doesn't offer EPR and it doesn't distinguish between central and/or obstructive apneas.
None of the ResMed NIV machines (and there are other models in this category that can deal with centrals besides the ASV) will distinguish between central apnea or obstructive apnea...both go into an unclassified apnea basket.
The assumption being that if the parameters are set properly the centrals will be treated and that only leaves obstructives to be flagged.

Now the ResMed ASV models that have the auto adjusting EPAP available...those machines can be dumbed down (tweaking the available settings) so that they function more like a regular auto adjusting bilevel or even an autoset.
So there is a lot of flexibility with the machine if someone knows and understands the various setting options. Heck, we can even make it work like cpap mode if we wanted to. :lol: Pretty expensive cpap mode though so obviously not something that we often want to do.

I have owned and used both the 36007 and the 36037 and both ASV modes have been tried and I DON'T have any problems with centrals...it can be used to treat plain OSA but it's an expensive option when compared to the cost of the regular apap machines and one needs to know what they are doing in terms of the settings and what to expect and look for.
I happened to find some killer hot deals on the machines I used or I wouldn't have done it. They were all used when I bought them.
No way could I afford new. Deals are out there but one has to be patient and at the same time prepared to close the deal fast if a hot deal is spotted because it won't last long. I have been burned twice on a Craigslist deal...once on a M series apap years ago and I lost my money on that one.
Got smarter and the second burn was paid through PayPal and I got my money back. The asshole never shipped but he kept offering it for sale on craigslist even while I was disputing things and in the process of getting my money back from PayPal.
For this reason I will often be more willing to pay slightly more to someone I might know on this forum than what I might spot on craigslist. Even if they got it off craigslist themselves...they are taking the risk that I just don't want to take.

Now if I could find something local on craigslist...yeah...I would go do the deal in person but where I live..it's mostly dinosaur bricks getting offered at 10 to 20 times the real market value. It's rare a good machine at a good price pops up on my local craigslist.
I may have to RISE but I refuse to SHINE.

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Pugsy
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Pugsy » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:47 am

Barb (Seattle) wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:32 am
Question pugsy. the s9 you have...it will force me to breathe if I have a central..right?

still learning about these machines....:D
Yes maam....it will breathe for you when/if you have a central. When you don't have a central pop up it works like a regular auto adjusting machine to deal the the obstructive side of your complex sleep apnea diagnosis.
What it does when a person is having a central is give you a rather big and brief burst of pressure to force you to inhale...it amounts to a big difference between inhale and exhale. Much larger and faster than your apap machine can deliver.
And it only does it when you need it...when you don't need it the machine will function pretty much like your apap machine.
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Jas_williams » Mon Apr 16, 2018 9:26 am

Barb (Seattle) wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:32 am
Question pugsy. the s9 you have...it will force me to breathe if I have a central..right?

still learning about these machines....:D

The ASV will encourage you to breath it can’t force you but it will try to make you breath with big pressure support

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Pugsy
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Pugsy » Mon Apr 16, 2018 9:53 am

Barb...ASV machines can't "force" a person to breathe in the sense that a lot of people think of when they think machine breathing...most think of those ventilators you see in movies and a person has a hole in their throat and the machine (that is called an invasive machine because of the trach) is causing the lungs to expand and exhale. These NIV machines aren't that powerful and they can't force that much air into the lungs.
What they do is encourage your own inhale/exhale function to move air by using the higher pressure support (that difference between inhale/exhale) which in turn pretty much equals a breath...your breath aided by the machine giving you a little push with high PS.
I may have to RISE but I refuse to SHINE.

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Barb (Seattle)
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Barb (Seattle) » Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:32 am

Pugsy wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 9:53 am
Barb...ASV machines can't "force" a person to breathe in the sense that a lot of people think of when they think machine breathing...most think of those ventilators you see in movies and a person has a hole in their throat and the machine (that is called an invasive machine because of the trach) is causing the lungs to expand and exhale. These NIV machines aren't that powerful and they can't force that much air into the lungs.
What they do is encourage your own inhale/exhale function to move air by using the higher pressure support (that difference between inhale/exhale) which in turn pretty much equals a breath...your breath aided by the machine giving you a little push with high PS.
ahhh ok :)

well, the other sleep center called (I had sent a scathing e-mail to them) and offered a free sleep test to "make up" for all their mess ups. nope. I'm sleep studied out.
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Barb (Seattle)
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Barb (Seattle) » Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:34 am

Pugsy wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:47 am
Barb (Seattle) wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:32 am
Question pugsy. the s9 you have...it will force me to breathe if I have a central..right?

still learning about these machines....:D
Yes maam....it will breathe for you when/if you have a central. When you don't have a central pop up it works like a regular auto adjusting machine to deal the the obstructive side of your complex sleep apnea diagnosis.
What it does when a person is having a central is give you a rather big and brief burst of pressure to force you to inhale...it amounts to a big difference between inhale and exhale. Much larger and faster than your apap machine can deliver.
And it only does it when you need it...when you don't need it the machine will function pretty much like your apap machine.
I just thought of when you're in the wind and the feeling it gives you....you gasp lol
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Pugsy » Mon Apr 16, 2018 11:00 am

Barb (Seattle) wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:34 am
I just thought of when you're in the wind and the feeling it gives you....you gasp lol
Hopefully you will be sound asleep when the "wind" kicks up and hopefully it won't wake you up when it does.
I will be honest...for some people when it does the high PS thing it needs to do for the centrals it can disturb some people until the brain learns that the "wind" is a good thing.
For some people it takes a while for the brain to get okay with the new way of doing things....I never really noticed it much.
I would see the machine kick in every now and then for a probable sleep onset central but it was never very often and I slept through it but then I had been using regular bilevel for a while before trying the ASV. I only knew it happened from looking at the pressure graphs the next day or whenever.

You've got 2 learning curves ahead of you...bilevel itself plus potentially high PS at times.
Nothing that can't be met though...and you and your brain will learn that the new way is a better way...after all you don't really have much choice do you if you want to deal with both the obstructive stuff and the central stuff at the same time.
I may have to RISE but I refuse to SHINE.

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Barb (Seattle)
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Barb (Seattle) » Mon Apr 16, 2018 6:07 pm

Pugsy wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 11:00 am
Barb (Seattle) wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:34 am
I just thought of when you're in the wind and the feeling it gives you....you gasp lol
Hopefully you will be sound asleep when the "wind" kicks up and hopefully it won't wake you up when it does.
I will be honest...for some people when it does the high PS thing it needs to do for the centrals it can disturb some people until the brain learns that the "wind" is a good thing.
For some people it takes a while for the brain to get okay with the new way of doing things....I never really noticed it much.
I would see the machine kick in every now and then for a probable sleep onset central but it was never very often and I slept through it but then I had been using regular bilevel for a while before trying the ASV. I only knew it happened from looking at the pressure graphs the next day or whenever.

You've got 2 learning curves ahead of you...bilevel itself plus potentially high PS at times.
Nothing that can't be met though...and you and your brain will learn that the new way is a better way...after all you don't really have much choice do you if you want to deal with both the obstructive stuff and the central stuff at the same time.
I wonder if they used the 22/18 pressure when I was asleep. because if they did, I didn't notice. That's a good thing. I don't forsee the pressure kicking up as a bad thing. I can't wait to see if it gives me relief <3 <3
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Barb (Seattle)
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Barb (Seattle) » Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:14 am

can't figure out how to do these in the message so...will do it here :D these first ones give you an idea of my fiddling with the pressure. It's not a pretty picture lol

last night I was on 17/13. still lots of apneas. grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr


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Pugsy
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Pugsy » Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:22 am

Can you get me last night's detailed report...with the graphs...and the only graphs I need on the right side...
Events
Flow rate
Pressure
Leak

Turn off the pie chart (Preferences/Appearance and remove show pie chart check mark)
and hide the calendar.

Be care and do NOT do the full screen toggle thing...there's a bug in SH that causes it to get to where you can't get out of full screen easily...so don't even go there.
I may have to RISE but I refuse to SHINE.

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Pugsy
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Pugsy » Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:30 am

Oh...heck...never mind...you were using fixed mode...that really doesn't help me much.

I wanted to see pressure variations and there won't be any from last night because it was in fixed mode.

Can we try auto mode tonight???? And let me see what the report from tonight shows...get it to me tomorrow morning before I ship the machine out?

Either that or go back and get me the detailed report from Monday Jan 5.

And of course your AHI is high...this machine can't do anything about the centrals/CAs and that's what most of your AHI is made up of.
You can fix the obstructive apnea stuff easily with this machine but you can't fix the central stuff with it.
I may have to RISE but I refuse to SHINE.

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Barb (Seattle)
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Barb (Seattle) » Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:34 am

sure. I'll try auto tonight. :)
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Barb (Seattle)
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Re: So...can't wait till Friday

Post by Barb (Seattle) » Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:35 am

I'll also do the report from Jan 5....it shows it being Friday Jan 5? is that the right one you want?
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