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General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
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WillSucceed
 
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Dreams -increasing and remembered?

Postby WillSucceed on Wed Jan 05, 2005 8:29 am

Since starting on CPAP a little over 2 months ago, I notice that I am having dreams every night and can often remember some of the content of the dreams when I wake in the morning. Sometimes I wake during the night and remember what I was dreaming.

So, the questions: does dreaming mean that I am accomplishing either more periods, or longer periods of REM sleep? (this would be a good thing)

and

does remembering the dreams mean that I am waking either during, or shortly after, REM sleep? (not such a good thing, I think)

Rested Gal!! Don't fail me... what do you know about dreaming relative to CPAP treatment.

Paul

JackStraw
 
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Dreams

Postby JackStraw on Wed Jan 05, 2005 5:57 pm

Hi Paul - I just got here today and as I posted on the intro thread, I dream vividly most every night and remember many of them - sometimes for weeks after. But I notice when the dreams are the most intense or just before I "wake up" is when I feel the worst. All day.
I was shot at point blank range in two dreams, and have fallen and hit bottom several times without ever waking up, at least not fully as one would as the result of a nightmare.
Lots of questions, still no answers and it's so frustrating. All in the wake of the surgery that prevented me from eating solid food for two weeks. Lived on Jell-O and popsicles.....

JS

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WillSucceed
 
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Dreams

Postby WillSucceed on Wed Jan 05, 2005 6:24 pm

You had surgery? Tell me about it... Did it help?
Paul

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Dreaming

Postby BetterBreathinBob on Wed Jan 05, 2005 7:16 pm

Yep,yep,yep. Remembering those dreams means that you wake up either in REM or just coming out of REM. The only harm or scary thing that could happen is called sleep paralysis when you wake up in REM, and your sketatal muscles are still in the state of paralysis which is normal when you dream. Your awake but can't move! If this happens, close those eyeballs, you'll fall back asleep and hopefully awaken from a different sleep stage.

Bob

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snamvar
 
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Postby snamvar on Wed Jan 05, 2005 9:00 pm

Hi,
I know that normally, you go 5 to 6 times through sleep cycles a night (stage 1,2,3,4,REM). I think after REM, you usually wake-up without knowing and start back at staget 1. Is this correct?
I don't do mornings !!!

IllinoisRRT
 
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Postby IllinoisRRT on Wed Jan 05, 2005 10:09 pm

I'm glad to hear that this has happened to others as well. I had a patient tell me that his only complaint with CPAP was the increase in his dreams, and in his case, it was not good. He had very frightening dreams and in some instances woke up with his hands wrapped around his wife's neck! Maybe they should put a warning out to all CPAP patients that this is a negative side effect? :)
Christine RRT

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Postby rested gal on Thu Jan 06, 2005 5:02 pm

Hi Paul :D

I know next to nothing about dreams, but here's my very unprofessional take on it:

As Bob said, if you remember a dream, you've waked up during REM. While dreaming is a healthy thing, I personally don't think that remembering dreams is a good thing. I think it's an indication that you were likely having an apnea or hypopnea strong enough to disturb your sleep. Obstructive events that are always more likely to happen during REM. The very events we want our machines to prevent.

To be able to commit the fact that you were dreaming to memory, whether you wake up with just a vague recollection of having had a dream, or some fuzzy details, or even a vivid colorful whole "story", I believe your REM sleep had to have been interrupted. Not good.

I think a lot of people who say, "I never dream" do, in fact dream - but just don't remember it. I also think that many people who say, "I dream a lot every night" are experiencing sleep disturbances that wake them enough to allow them to remember the dreams.

When people first get started on cpap treatment, it does seem that they report "dreaming more" or "dreaming more vividly" for the first days, weeks, or even months. My personal opinion is that cpap treatment itself can be so difficult to "sleep through" (masks, leaks, noises, hose tugging at us, pressure blowing, etc.) that the strangness of the treatment itself might be waking us more often in the early days of treatment - thus being more likely to have some of those wakeups happen during REM.

People who have been sleep deprived prior to cpap treatment do tend to experience "REM rebound" when they finally start getting good sleep again, but (and I think this is a big "but"....) I don't think it's a good sign if we are remembering dreams - whether it's REM rebound dreams or during normal amounts of REM. Either way, I think remembering a dream means sleep was disturbed enough to wake you up.

I rarely remember a dream with the exception of sometimes either vaguely or clearly remembering a "last dream" upon awakening to get up in the morning. And that's only if I have set the alarm clock, or some other noise like phone or a dog barking awakens me. If I awake on my own in the morning, I never remember having dreamed. I think that's really the way it should be. Just my opinion. :D

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Postby littlebaddow on Fri Jan 07, 2005 3:53 am

I experienced many vivid, often scary dreams whilst suffering the worst symptoms in the lead up to the diagnosis and thinking back, I'm sure this had built up over many months & probably longer.
I've now been using the machine for just over a month and didn't notice any change to the dream pattern initially. Over the last 2 weeks, however, I've started to gradually feel better and now that I think about it, there does seem to have been a reduction in how often I can remember dreaming.
Early days for me yet & not very scientific, but based on other contributors comments (which are as always hugely informative to us newcomers) this would seem to suggest that not remembering dreams may be a sign that you're sleeping better.

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Postby ldemmery on Fri Jan 07, 2005 6:12 am

So from what's been said here...not remembering dreams is a good thing... yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay!!!!!!!

I thought something wasn't right...but I guess it's OK then. I haven't remembered dreaming in some weeks. So CPAP is working then. Good, glad to hear it! (I've been doing it since October).

Lynne

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Hugh Jass
 
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Postby Hugh Jass on Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:34 am

Restedgal is exactly right.

Apneatic events can often increase/occur during REM and I'm proof of that.

I wake up during every every dream (very 90-120 minutes). My CPAP has normally doubled the pressure during my REM stage of sleep. (This was verified by checking the pressure when I am awakened).

Not remembering your dreams is a better indicator of improvement (at least in my case).

Regards.

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rested gal
 
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Postby rested gal on Fri Jan 07, 2005 11:23 am

Christine RRT, far from being a negative side effect of cpap (and I realize you were joking :wink: ) perhaps that patient has a touch of REM behavior disorder? At any rate, if he's remembering many dreams while on cpap, perhaps his cpap therapy isn't optimized for him yet? Just a thought or two. :)

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WillSucceed
 
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dreams

Postby WillSucceed on Fri Jan 07, 2005 2:56 pm

Rested Gal:

I'll bite... what is REM behaviour disorder?

Paul

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rested gal
 
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Postby rested gal on Fri Jan 07, 2005 3:38 pm

Paul:

REM behavior disorder

Ain't Google a wonderful thing? :D

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WillSucceed
 
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REM behaviour disorder

Postby WillSucceed on Fri Jan 07, 2005 3:54 pm

I guess I'm going to find out...

IllinoisRRT
 
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Postby IllinoisRRT on Fri Jan 07, 2005 10:20 pm

rested gal wrote:Christine RRT, far from being a negative side effect of cpap (and I realize you were joking :wink: ) perhaps that patient has a touch of REM behavior disorder? At any rate, if he's remembering many dreams while on cpap, perhaps his cpap therapy isn't optimized for him yet? Just a thought or two. :)


I would guess the same. The problem is, over the course of several years on CPAP, it's happened just a handful of times, so the chance of really being able to test these weird behaviors is minimal. But he was the first one I've seen who's mentioned such a problem (til I saw it on here anyway!).
Christine RRT

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