I think I'm onto Something Here

[NightHawkeye]

I guess I’m just one of the lucky ones who managed to get immediate benefits from CPAP use. I needed something to help me get through the night and CPAP has done that for me, and more. I realized yesterday, for instance, that I haven’t nodded off in one of the dreadfully boring meetings at work for some time.

Despite the improvement, my AHI has been wandering, occasionally under 10 some nights but for the past week up over 30. Increasing pressure hasn’t helped – only made me feel worse. Taking Protonix for reflux has improved how I feel, but hasn’t helped AHI at all. (To satiate those inclined to tell me to see the doc about this – I already did. The best he could offer was to keep doing what I’ve been doing, since it’s obviously working. He had nothing new to offer.)

Anyway, the reason for the post is that during a half-awake moment before getting up yesterday morning, as I could feel the Respironics machine responding to my windpipe closures (biofeedback is a wonderful thing), I realized that changing my lower jaw position affected this. If I jutted my jaw out the windpipe stayed open.

So, in a rare moment of clarity, a few things suddenly made sense. The attempts at reducing leaks by tightening the Ultra Mirage FF mask had caused AHI to increase. Sure enough, last night when I relaxed the lower straps, the AHI dropped back down to where it had been prior to the past week or so. The tight mask, high AHI effect also seems to account, at least partially, for why increasing pressure did not resolve my apneas, only made me feel worse.

OK, so I guess it’s time to try a nasal mask. Not real positive about that though, because even though I do a full nasal irrigation every night and use high humidity and the heated hose, my nose still clogs up in the wee hours of the morning. Somewhat expecting the nasal mask to fail, yesterday I even ordered the dental device from h*ll to see how much improvement it can provide.

Call me optimistic, but I really think I’m onto something here.

Regards,
Bill

[yardbird]

Bill-

Great observations! This is such a personal disorder that I think we are all realizing the even teh treatment isn't simply a cut-and-dry "do this and it will work".

Different things work for different people. Probably because our apneas are not all equal. The conditions that CAUSE the apnea are probably somewhat different from person to person.

I say, if it HELPS... go for it!

And as far as the nasal pillow device.... man, I used to wake up stuffy as well. I DON'T with my nasal pillows (I use the Swift). I do notice that after my morning shower and can blow my nose and clear things out, BUT ...and maybe it's the air forced up my nose while sleeping... I am not stuffy when I wake up.

Your mileage may very... that's just how it's working for me.

[WillSucceed]

OK, so I guess it’s time to try a nasal mask. Not real positive about that though

Bill:
I had congestion-from-hell every night, starting shortly after I got into bed. I tried everything from air cleaners to regular vacuuming of the bed (gotta get rid of those dust mites and their protein-laden poo) to plasticated matress protectors to high-heat laundry equipment that is guaranteed to kill the dust mites, to nose sprays, etc. Nothing resolved the stuffyness and congestion until I switched to nasal pillows.

Hallelujah!!! the congestion problem is solved. I'd encourage you to give the nasal pillows a try.

Good-luck!

[Jim Eads]

Bill,

Give the nasal mask a try.

I always thought I was a mouth breather and there was no way I could keep my mouth shut while sleeping. I was wrong. Easiest thing in the world. I go to sleep breathing through my nose and my mouth stays closed. I was amazed.

Jim

[NightHawkeye]

Thanks guys,

I went ahead and ordered both the Swift nasal pillows and the Ultra Mirage nasal mask (although thinking about it now, I kinda wonder how much sense it made to order both at the same time). I should find out tomorrow night just how well the nasal thing is gonna work.

Regards,
Bill

[snork1]

[quote="NightHawkeye"]Thanks guys,

I went ahead and ordered both the Swift nasal pillows and the Ultra Mirage nasal mask (although thinking about it now, I kinda wonder how much sense it made to order both at the same time). I should find out tomorrow night just how well the nasal thing is gonna work.

Regards,
Bill

[laurel]

Glad that someone is onto something!

I suffer from congestion (and have smaller than average nasal passages to boot), but since my doc prescribed a nasal spray, that's really helped. That and breathing filtered air all night (using a Swift or Aura mask).

I recently discovered that I sleep much better at a much lower pressure when I sleep sitting up in a recliner. Overall it's better. I discovered this by accident (couldn't sleep in a bed at a hotel, ended up sleeping in a chair with APAP; then noticed the stats took a steep change).

I don't think I'm gonna switch to sleeping in a chair all the time, but it's Good To Know. I mean, it makes sense. And I may do it some of the time (but then right now I'm all about changing factors and seeing how it affects my stats. Can you tell I just got the software working earlier this week?).

[NightHawkeye]

I recently discovered that I sleep much better at a much lower pressure when I sleep sitting up in a recliner.

Been there, done that! I slept sitting up for the past few years and I am so relieved after starting CPAP to finally be able to sleep lying down again.

It could be that the reason I slept better sitting up has a lot to do with gravity pulling my jaw forward, thereby minimizing the apnea. Maybe you have something similar going on.

Good luck with your own treatment, Laurel, and thanks for posting. These little tidbits of information help us understand and deal with this nasty condition of apnea.

Regards,
Bill

[snoozie_suzy]

Laurel and Bill,

Its very coincidental reading both of your posts about your 'jaw'. I have seen an oral surgeon for tmj injections for years. Years of grinding my teeth while I sleep has caused one of my tmj joints to pop in and out of joint. Anyhow, when I last saw him I told him I was diagnosed with sleep apnea and that maybe it had something to do with being slightly chubby. But I told him for as long as I can remember even in my teens when I was very thin, I would constantly nap after school or work. He didn't think my diagnosis was all that strange or even weight related. He said my jaw line, or actually lack thereof, was small. He termed it "recessed chin" could factor in to my sleep apnea. He also commented on how small and "crowded" things were in my airway. I never had my adenoids or tonsils out as a kid. He said that things were crowded while I was awake and sitting up, so just imagine what happens when I lay down and tissues relax in an already narrow area.

I just thought both of your posts made a lot of sense. And wonder if maybe I should try wearing my mouth guard again so as to pull my jaw forward somewhat?

Suzy

[NightHawkeye]

He said my jaw line, or actually lack thereof, was small. He termed it "recessed chin" could factor in to my sleep apnea. He also commented on how small and "crowded" things were in my airway. I never had my adenoids or tonsils out as a kid.

Hmm. . ., let's see: recessed chin - Yep, I got that - (that's why I got the beard, too); adenoids and tonsils - Yep, I got them, too.

I'm gonna be disappointed if the moldable dental device from h*ll that I ordered doesn't improve things.

Suzy, have you tried the mouthguard since your apnea diagnosis?

Regards,
Bill

[laurel]

Yeah, I've got a "recessed chin" alright. My least favorite "feature".

I slept in a chair quite often in the last couple of years, simply because I kept falling asleep there and/or had insomnia when I tried to sleep. Turns out I may have been doing myself a favor by sleeping that way, probably reduced the apnea events to some degree.

[steveksmith]

I think I have the same issue. When I read this post, I thought "that's me". I can lay there and actually feel like I'm closing the air off to my throat and then push my lower jaw out as far as I can and it seems like everything just opens up and there's no way I couldn't close off the air.

I'm thinking about a dental device. Any suggestions. What's the success rate?

[NightHawkeye]

I'm thinking about a dental device. Any suggestions. What's the success rate?

From what I've read, dental devices only work for some people, so I suspect the success rate is rather low.

It is, however, an easy thing to try. I ordered mine from Sleep Pro. I've read some unkind things about them on this forum - things like molding the device burns the gums. (I hope to avoid that pain.) I also read recently on this forum about somebody who fashioned his own device and claimed it was effective. I may try that this weekend also, as it's gonna be at least another week before I get the Sleep Pro.

Regards,
Bill

[neverbetter]

My chin is the same. I have TMJ and have woren my teeth down a bit. My son just had his tons and adds removed because of sleep apnea, too. I still have mine...should probably have a look at getting them removed. Do most people have them removed that use a PAP device?

[steveksmith]

Well, I've ordered a reader so I can see how my treatment is going. I have been on the CPAP for two weeks and the first mask did not fit me right. The 2nd is a Swift and I don't have a problem with it, but my problem is that I feel more tired now than I did before using the machine. It seems others feel great after a few nights and I don't. I'm thinking maybe I need the mouthpiece to keep my chin forward or something. Maybe the reader and software will give me an indication of what I'm doing wrong. All I know is I'm frustrated right now.