forced to use CPAP machine

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
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Julie
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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by Julie » Wed Jul 30, 2014 3:40 am

Most of the time people have trouble with the mask because they didn't get the one that fits them properly, in their size, that doesn't have to be too tight to work well and that doesn't leak even if it's not too tight. We can help you figure out how to find the right mask, so give us the full name and model number of your machine (there are so many similar ones) and the full name and type (nasal or full face) of your mask so we at least know what you have now and can make suggestions about how to re-adjust things so you're comfortable.

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by LSAT » Wed Jul 30, 2014 6:09 am

According to your post you have been using CPAP for over 2 years (4- 6 month periods) and you still can't sleep......I wouldn't want you driving a truck anywhere near me.

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by justmeagain » Wed Jul 30, 2014 10:05 am

If you think that you don't have sleep apnea get tested again...at a sleep place of your choice.

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by zoocrewphoto » Wed Jul 30, 2014 10:23 am

Just wanted to add that a sleep test knows when you are asleep and when you are not. You can ask for a copy of the data with the graphs that show your events during the night. But the fact that you felt like you didn't sleep much doesn't mean that you don't have sleep apnea. I did a split night study, and they were able to get so much data in 2 hours and 15 minutes that they were able to move along to the titration phase right away. If somebody is severe enough, it doesn't take much data to see that. Have you ever dozed off and woken yourself up with your own snoring, even snorting a bit? Well, it didn't take much sleep to stop breathing and force yourself awake.

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by bv1800 » Wed Jul 30, 2014 10:32 am

jencat824 wrote: There are rare cases in which weight loss has an impact on OSA but typically this is not the case.
While I will, in no way, argue against this point, there is a chance that he's one of the lucky rare cases where losing weight will make a difference. If he's got 60-70 lbs to lose, then there's a chance (albeit, a small one) that losing the weight could work. If so, it represents an opportunity for him to achieve his goal of being allowed to not use a CPAP and still keep his job.

To me, this is the only plan that has any chance of working, with the outcomes that he desires (although, it's in no way a guaranteed result).

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by BlackSpinner » Wed Jul 30, 2014 10:37 am

nole wrote:
library lady wrote:You will likely get some answers if you give more details. I for one would like to know why you think you are being "forced" to use a machine.
I am a truck driver. When i signed a contract with a company i work for they measured neck (done by a desk clerk) told me to sign a paper to participate in the Sleep study due to having a thick neck and therefore being in a risky group. I signed because i needed a job. They sent me to spend a night in a sleeping clinic. I did. Then the problems started. 40 sondas on my body and head, all kind of masks changed during the night, being woke up several time to fix the sond that fell off my leg, changing all types of masks during the night. Of course i did not sleep and the result was that i had a severe sleep apnea with AHI 34. They gave the CPAP machine. First meeting with a lady doctor was with the words like this: Oh all you need to use it for about 3-4 months and you are cured. After first six months of using it every day was the same result below 1. She was delighted and gave me the green light. I asked her to send it to my company so that do not have to use it again. Never happened. After that another six months using the results were the same only she increased the pressure. The the story was like this: oh you can stop using this machine only if you loose 6- to 70 pounds of your body weight. After another six months i recorded our conversation and told her all that. She denied all had been said of course. I asked for all my results and a video. They gave it me. I begged everyone and her to stop this madness because i can not sleep with this sh.t. After another six months she was determent that i am stuck with her, she is stuck with a company i work for and it goes on. All that time my results are the same AHI index is always below 1. Now is more clear why i ask for advise, help or the name of any lawyer who can help me with this. Please answer.
I think you were probably too sleep deprived to hear what was being said. No one gets cured from OSA by using a cpap machine. Your AHI on the machine means you are "cured" as long as you use the machine. You have a 50% chance of "curing" your OSA by losing all the weight, but the weight could be a result of the OSA. Until you lose the weight and have another sleep study without the cpap and score under 5 for AHI.

If you are in Ontario any driver can lose their license for not using their cpap machine.
Yes, People don't want you on the road if you are not using it. You are an accident waiting to happen if you don't use. Potentially dead kids littering the road in your wake.

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by 49er » Wed Jul 30, 2014 10:40 am

Jencat, Pugsy, or anyone else who is in the know, what are the DOT rules regarding using dental appliances for sleep apnea? Statistically, the OP is right outside the moderate range, which according to the study I have posted on this site, generally has about a 60% chance of getting the AHI below 5 with an adjustable appliance.

It just seems a shame if he has struggled so much with pap therapy, that this wouldn't be a viable option. Of course, he may not have had much assistance in adjusting.

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by Jeff241 » Wed Jul 30, 2014 10:54 am

bv1800 wrote:
jencat824 wrote: There are rare cases in which weight loss has an impact on OSA but typically this is not the case.
While I will, in no way, argue against this point, there is a chance that he's one of the lucky rare cases where losing weight will make a difference. If he's got 60-70 lbs to lose, then there's a chance (albeit, a small one) that losing the weight could work. If so, it represents an opportunity for him to achieve his goal of being allowed to not use a CPAP and still keep his job.

To me, this is the only plan that has any chance of working, with the outcomes that he desires (although, it's in no way a guaranteed result).
I would say that's his only real option to try. Without losing weight he will have to stay on CPAP. If he loses 60-70 lbs he might get off of CPAP. Even if he can't get off CPAP by losing the weight it would be better for his health anyway. Not that it's easy to lose weight.
zoocrewphoto wrote:Just wanted to add that a sleep test knows when you are asleep and when you are not. You can ask for a copy of the data with the graphs that show your events during the night. But the fact that you felt like you didn't sleep much doesn't mean that you don't have sleep apnea. I did a split night study, and they were able to get so much data in 2 hours and 15 minutes that they were able to move along to the titration phase right away. If somebody is severe enough, it doesn't take much data to see that. Have you ever dozed off and woken yourself up with your own snoring, even snorting a bit? Well, it didn't take much sleep to stop breathing and force yourself awake.
I had a whopping 82 minutes during my study, but it was enough to diagnose me. I didn't feel like I got any sleep that night either.
But I didn't sleep enough to get titration done so I got to go back for a titration study.

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by library lady » Wed Jul 30, 2014 11:21 am

The other posters are right; your job as a truck driver is in jeopardy if you don't use your machine... an AHI of 1 while you are using it will allow you to keep your job... or would you rather go look for a different job that doesn't require it? The green light your doc gave you, was the green light for your continued employment, not to stop using cpap - as another poster said, you were too sleep deprived to understand what she was telling you. No lawyer will help you circumvent the rules on this.

You are obviously having trouble adjusting to it, please let us know specifically what about it is keeping you from getting sleep? Is it the mask, or uncomfortable breathing, or what? We are here to help you with those adjustments, but we can only help if we know what difficulties you are having, and what equipment you are using...which mask, machine, etc.

I would not have been able to continue cpap if I hadn't found this forum 5 months ago. in addition to getting answers to my specific questions, I learned much just by reading threads that spoke about the problems I was having.

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by Goofproof » Wed Jul 30, 2014 11:32 am

bv1800 wrote:
jencat824 wrote: There are rare cases in which weight loss has an impact on OSA but typically this is not the case.
While I will, in no way, argue against this point, there is a chance that he's one of the lucky rare cases where losing weight will make a difference. If he's got 60-70 lbs to lose, then there's a chance (albeit, a small one) that losing the weight could work. If so, it represents an opportunity for him to achieve his goal of being allowed to not use a CPAP and still keep his job.

To me, this is the only plan that has any chance of working, with the outcomes that he desires (although, it's in no way a guaranteed result).
There is also a chance his aging process will reverse, and he will get younger every day, allowing his body tissue to tone holding his airway open like it was when he was a kid. But the odds of this happening is also is also low. Many in De-Nile find this reasonable. Jim
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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by Sleeper Agent » Wed Jul 30, 2014 11:55 am

nole wrote:Of course i did not sleep and the result was that i had a severe sleep apnea with AHI 34.
The AHI produced by an in-lab sleep study is almost certainly not related to sleep quality/quantity. Even if you did sleep and had full comfort, your AHI is likely to be severe and at around 34.

Do you not feel better (more awake, energetic, focused, happy etc) after using CPAP and getting your AHI down to 1?

Also, CPAP is for life. Your clinic really sucks.

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by bv1800 » Wed Jul 30, 2014 12:26 pm

Goofproof wrote:
bv1800 wrote:
jencat824 wrote: There are rare cases in which weight loss has an impact on OSA but typically this is not the case.
While I will, in no way, argue against this point, there is a chance that he's one of the lucky rare cases where losing weight will make a difference. If he's got 60-70 lbs to lose, then there's a chance (albeit, a small one) that losing the weight could work. If so, it represents an opportunity for him to achieve his goal of being allowed to not use a CPAP and still keep his job.

To me, this is the only plan that has any chance of working, with the outcomes that he desires (although, it's in no way a guaranteed result).
There is also a chance his aging process will reverse, and he will get younger every day, allowing his body tissue to tone holding his airway open like it was when he was a kid. But the odds of this happening is also is also low. Many in De-Nile find this reasonable. Jim
Well, since there are actually documented cases where weight loss resulted in the patient being able to give up CPAP therapy, I'd say that my scenario is vastly more likely than yours (your's doesn't have "low" odds, it has "no" odds as in zero). It's not like I'm saying every one with OSA is a lard butt who needs to lose weight and that weight loss will guarantee to lower OSA events to the point of being able to go off therapy. Anyone who thinks that an obese person losing weight has essentially no chance of working is in as much De-Nile as the person who guarantees that it will work.

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by Julie » Wed Jul 30, 2014 12:42 pm

The people here who are stating that it's not very likely to work are people with long experience of studying this and are very knowledgable. They aren't just guessing at it... and all too often people come on here saying e.g. they want to sell their machine, etc. because they lost weight, but haven't had a new sleep study to test things, and we urge them to do that, and unfortunately, once they've done it, come back a bit with their tail between their legs saying they still need Cpap. And a good reason for that is that their OSA was not weight related to begin with, but anatomical (or occasionally neurological).

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by bv1800 » Wed Jul 30, 2014 12:50 pm

Julie wrote:The people here who are stating that it's not very likely to work are people with long experience of studying this and are very knowledgable. They aren't just guessing at it... and all too often people come on here saying e.g. they want to sell their machine, etc. because they lost weight, but haven't had a new sleep study to test things, and we urge them to do that, and unfortunately, once they've done it, come back a bit with their tail between their legs saying they still need Cpap. And a good reason for that is that their OSA was not weight related to begin with, but anatomical (or occasionally neurological).
I get your point regarding people being to quick to assume that weight loss means OSA is "cured" (or at least lowered to the point of not needing a CPAP) and I completely agree. My only point is that there is an actual chance (albeit low) that it COULD work, so the OP should give it a try, before he tries to circumvent the law. For someone to come on here and say that it's as likely as regressing the aging process is completely unjustified.

I submit the following link which reports the results from a study by the American Thoracic Society as tangible proof that it CAN happen (although, I wouldn't bet on the 88% number for patients who lose 33 lbs or more):

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 081319.htm

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Re: forced to use CPAP machine

Post by chunkyfrog » Wed Jul 30, 2014 12:51 pm

It does not make sense that you would still be tired after 2 years of successful therapy.
In your place, I would be seeing doctors until the real cause in uncovered.
Chemical imbalance, or a number of other health situations can be responsible for your symptoms.
Please see a doctor, and get this straightened out. Some of those other conditions could be worse than OSA.
Sometimes even doctors fail to look further, to the detriment of the patient.

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