Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
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happysleeper
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Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by happysleeper » Sun Aug 22, 2010 10:14 am

White Noise, I am interested in the myzeo for my daughter, who suffers from insomnia (sleep study coming up soon). How much does it cost?

With my polygrip/tape set up, I woke up this morning a little thirsty at about 4AM. I moved the polygrip on the side of my mouth over slightly with my finger, stuck a straw in there and took a sip of water. When done, pushed the polygrip back, got it wet again with water and resealed, and went back to sleep. Don't know how it would work with taking pills, though, wouldn't want to choke and not be able top open my mouth...

Linda, glad to give hope! I've gotten so much hope from this website! ~HS

WhiteNoise
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Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by WhiteNoise » Sun Aug 22, 2010 11:03 am

Happycamper, the Zeo device is 199 with a 30 day trial. The dry sensor headbands last 3 months each and I think you get 3 of them to start but that would be an ongoing expense. I used mine every night for 6++ months pre-cpap (can't wear it with the papcap as it must contact the skin on the forehead) ) and found it quite helpful and encouraging to know things about my sleep in an objective manner vs guesses about say how long it took to get to sleep, how long I was actually asleep, how many times and at what time I would awaken and for how long (this one is surprising as many short wakes of 5 minutes or less can leave one thinking they "were up all night") and of course seeing deep sleep (I get almost none) and REM is pretty cool! No device like it for the consumer so I took the plunge. When I get a stable working system of use with the cpap (hopefully without a head bound chin strap and using nasal pillows) going I think it could be interesting to correlate the AHI with the sleep data.

Appreciate your telling me about your polident straw situation last night and that you could actually manage it. wow! Last night for me, I unclipped the bottom liberty straps, lifted the mask a little, tilted my head back, and VERY carefully guided the 8 "vitamins" one at a time in my mouth following it with a sip from a straw. Sheeesh, like a circus act. The nasal pillows stayed put in part held by the "panty hose fix" and me being extra gentle. I recall thinking that a funnel type "chute" (narrow at mouth end and wider to accept the pills) would help me get those suckers in my gullet easier without possibly disturbing my "delicate sealing situation".

Thought I slept all right, but am feeling kinda crappy as I type. That's one thing Learned from using the Zeo. ONE night's sleep can not show a pattern. Knowing how you slept quantitatively (like AHI or seeing the events with software) over time is the best way to know why you feel like you do during the day, but can also motivate you if you have one poor day to hang on seeing cause and affect.

Yep, this group is a life saver!
Customization and support keeps me trying 10 years, not there yet.

WhiteNoise
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Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by WhiteNoise » Mon Aug 23, 2010 12:58 pm

MODIFIED ORAL MASK AS TAPE/POLIDENT/CHINSTRAP ALTERNATIVE for use with NASAL PILLOWS ? (2 part simple sealing system)

Last night I tried the polident strip cut in half and nexcare clear flexible tape strip vertical with my mouth nose liberty mask only (no papcap chinstrap) and darned if the tape and polident didn't loosen up even with the equalized pressure of a full face with nasal pillows mask! I woke up full at 2am and started over using the nexcare 3m micropore (gentle paper tape) and it too began to loosen up on the lower lip which eventually woke me up so the sleep was disordered.

If I can't make all this work on a ff mask I don't see how I will with my much desired Swift LT (or new in box opus or swift FX) MY mouth it appears IS GOING TO OPEN and when it does it dries out bad. (any mask)

Fortunately or unfortunately my mind goes into "think through all scenarios mode" when I encounter a problem and I was at least partially awake from 2am on. Many thoughts on sealing the mouth to use the pillows and I have not seen this idea of mine mentioned here and request other tinkerer types thoughts on the possibility of using a MODIFIED ORAL MASK
https://www.cpap.com/productpage/fisher ... -mask.html AS A WAY TO SEAL THE MOUTH instead of tape, denture adhesives, chinstraps or combinations of them at once. I would need to modify it in some way so as to plug the front portal (would be nice if it was a removable silicone plug with a tight tapered end to fit the hole) where the air is meant to enter. since it is a mask it should seal like any other and has only single straps to hold it. If there was a room for the nasal pillows above it it seems like a nice simple solution to mouth sealing without the mess of polident or the pain of tape that COULD BE EASILY REMOVED IN THE NIGHT without waking me up all the way.

Anyone given this idea any thought? I'd be willing to order one to modify with ideas of execution from more experienced folks here. Oracle users thoughts would be helpful as to how it works and seals and the space above for the pillows.
Customization and support keeps me trying 10 years, not there yet.

WhiteNoise
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Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by WhiteNoise » Mon Oct 05, 2015 2:59 pm

2 years fully compliant, but never with a solid seal, or able to solve the mouth breathing dilemma. I feel I gave it my 100% best effort, but even with the support available here,
cpap is a dream never fully realized for me. Recall a few nights luxuriating in the peaceful deep airway opened Nirvana, but the rest was me turned Mcgiver, and continuing to push my face, teeth, and head tighter and tighter into what could not have been healthy. Some dental issues required a soft tissue graft and no cpap for 2 weeks as it healed.

As my apnea is mild to moderate I am not in danger of serious stroke or such, and decided to go without it. It's been 3 years and I am having some more dental work, and the dentist is interested in me finding a way to overcome my mouth breathing dry mouth which is decaying my teeth. I was thinking room humidifier than remembered my S9 and Opus 360, with a faint hope, but then am back stuck in the place I have always been,,,,,,,,, nothing reliably, consistently ,or with any reasonable degree of comfort (taped my lips so diligently they bled and I allowed it in search of a decent sleep) would keep my mouth shut.

In the years is there anything NEW, such as an oral device that hold the lips pursed that is easily removed in the night so I can take pills?

I always here folks say it can be done with perseverance, but I have that and did put in the time and effort and education, but am back seeking help.

Anyone have any ideas? The holy grail for me is to simply use my nasal pillows which are light and comfy, without strapping my face or taping or gluing (polident)my lips. My anatomical facial and dental structure is such that nothing has worked truly.

3 years later, i hope someone can offer something new.

Jim
Customization and support keeps me trying 10 years, not there yet.

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kteague
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Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by kteague » Mon Oct 05, 2015 3:46 pm

Wow, what a long time to struggle. Hopefully there will be some helpful input for you. Do you have nasal issues going on that are forcing the mouth breathing?

_________________
Mask: TAP PAP Nasal Pillow CPAP Mask with Improved Stability Mouthpiece
Humidifier: S9™ Series H5i™ Heated Humidifier with Climate Control
Additional Comments: Bleep/DreamPort for full nights, Tap Pap for shorter sessions

WhiteNoise
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Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by WhiteNoise » Mon Oct 05, 2015 3:57 pm

Yes, I have nasal issues at night. I'm a nose breather during the day with my tongue up in the right place, but at night I get congested esp if I don't moisturize the passages with a "Netti pot". Feel like it is time to re-evaluate this area of my life with a fresh perspective. No more FF masks for me though, It's nasal or nothing.
Customization and support keeps me trying 10 years, not there yet.

SteveGold
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Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by SteveGold » Mon Oct 05, 2015 5:54 pm

Have you tried a cervical collar? They help prevent your jaw from dropping open, without pulling your jaw back like a chin strap does. They go for about $10 on Amazon. Might be worth a shot.

WhiteNoise
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Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by WhiteNoise » Mon Oct 05, 2015 6:40 pm

I haven't tried a cervical collar, but I like the direction it takes, that I wouldn't have thought of on my own. It would bring the lower jaw up from below as opposed
to the whole head being forced together. I can see how this at the least might allow the start of a closed mouth in a comfortable manner, to try and perhaps modify further if necessary.

I'll look, but is this idea discussed in these forums?
Thank you!

Jim
Customization and support keeps me trying 10 years, not there yet.

SteveGold
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Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by SteveGold » Mon Oct 05, 2015 9:04 pm

Yup, I got the idea from other members. Some people here wear the collar every night (I only use it occasionally if I'm in a rough patch). Sometimes I use it in combination with mouth taping for more "insurance." It seems to discourage your mouth from opening and also minimizes head and neck movement that might dislodge your mask or otherwise interfere with treatment. The downside is that wearing it, while not uncomfortable, does take a little getting used to.

yaconsult
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Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by yaconsult » Mon Oct 05, 2015 11:05 pm

I think that masks have improved greatly in the last few years. Have you tried some newer masks? A survey I ran here showed the airfit p10 as being the most popular nasal cushion mask by far and cpap.com sells them for a good price and includes free return insurance on them. I love it as it's a tiny slip of a thing that I can forget that I'm wearing and it just stays in place. A hose hanger keeps the hose suspended over my head and allows me to turn from side to side without affecting the seal.

I discovered that I was blowing air out between my lips when I was sleeping so I have been taping my lips together with 3M Micropore tape and that seems to be working well for me. Some people cut a slip in the middle of the tape and that would allow for pill taking.

I hope you are able to find something that works well for you!

_________________
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Additional Comments: January 2015 Sleep Study Results: Apnea/Hypopnea Index (AHI): 80.2, Sleepyhead

WhiteNoise
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Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by WhiteNoise » Tue Oct 06, 2015 8:33 am

SteveGold wrote:Yup, I got the idea from other members. Some people here wear the collar every night (I only use it occasionally if I'm in a rough patch). Sometimes I use it in combination with mouth taping for more "insurance." It seems to discourage your mouth from opening and also minimizes head and neck movement that might dislodge your mask or otherwise interfere with treatment. The downside is that wearing it, while not uncomfortable, does take a little getting used to.
I suspect that in my case success will come by a combination of approaches not one magic bullet, and after 2 years I simply ran out of combinations to try and let it go. This idea is new and is why I came back to this very supportive forum hoping for something such you put in front of me. I have an overbite with a "small mouth" and there is a space between my lips when closed, esp so, as my mouth drops at night in deeper sleep. I ordered a cervical collar from Amazon last night and will begin with that to see what it gets me. Might be that less taping or other such procedures could be handled before it gets "blown out" as saliva collects in the night and it slowly separates.

I've also considered using a nasal only mask with the lowest possible pressure figuring that any benefit is better than none at first. As my nasal passageways become congested at night I mouth breathe more so at night, but the humidification (after 3 years) might open it up. I see there are perhaps scamish "nasal tube devices on the web which are inserted into the nostrils which purport to "open them up for better nose breathing". If any one has an opinion feel free to contribute.

Jim
Customization and support keeps me trying 10 years, not there yet.

WhiteNoise
Posts: 36
Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 5:35 pm

Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by WhiteNoise » Tue Oct 06, 2015 8:40 am

yaconsult wrote:I think that masks have improved greatly in the last few years. Have you tried some newer masks? A survey I ran here showed the airfit p10 as being the most popular nasal cushion mask by far and cpap.com sells them for a good price and includes free return insurance on them. I love it as it's a tiny slip of a thing that I can forget that I'm wearing and it just stays in place. A hose hanger keeps the hose suspended over my head and allows me to turn from side to side without affecting the seal.

I discovered that I was blowing air out between my lips when I was sleeping so I have been taping my lips together with 3M Micropore tape and that seems to be working well for me. Some people cut a slip in the middle of the tape and that would allow for pill taking.

I hope you are able to find something that works well for you!
I had given up on Cpap for the last 3 years (2 years previously and continuously faithful prior, but stopped as the negatives of so much gear on my head seemed to outweigh the positives) I had been using the Opus 360 as my preferred nasal option, and had tried the Swift without result. I'll have a look at the Airfit P10. I used to use the 3M micropore tape and it is quite a tight bond so it hold well, but I used to lose some nips of skin on my lips it did so well, when removing it. The 4am wake requires me to take 8 large sized oval tablets so s slit probably wouldn't cut it for me.

Thank you!
Jim
Customization and support keeps me trying 10 years, not there yet.

WhiteNoise
Posts: 36
Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 5:35 pm

Re: Nasal Pillow Users -- 50 ways to seal your mouth

Post by WhiteNoise » Mon Oct 12, 2015 4:44 pm

WhiteNoise wrote:
SteveGold wrote:Yup, I got the idea from other members. Some people here wear the collar every night (I only use it occasionally if I'm in a rough patch). Sometimes I use it in combination with mouth taping for more "insurance." It seems to discourage your mouth from opening and also minimizes head and neck movement that might dislodge your mask or otherwise interfere with treatment. The downside is that wearing it, while not uncomfortable, does take a little getting used to.
I suspect that in my case success will come by a combination of approaches not one magic bullet, and after 2 years I simply ran out of combinations to try and let it go. This idea is new and is why I came back to this very supportive forum hoping for something such you put in front of me. I have an overbite with a "small mouth" and there is a space between my lips when closed, esp so, as my mouth drops at night in deeper sleep. I ordered a cervical collar from Amazon last night and will begin with that to see what it gets me. Might be that less taping or other such procedures could be handled before it gets "blown out" as saliva collects in the night and it slowly separates.

I've also considered using a nasal only mask with the lowest possible pressure figuring that any benefit is better than none at first. As my nasal passageways become congested at night I mouth breathe more so at night, but the humidification (after 3 years) might open it up. I see there are perhaps scamish "nasal tube devices on the web which are inserted into the nostrils which purport to "open them up for better nose breathing". If any one has an opinion feel free to contribute.

Jim
Bought the Cervical collar and it isn't going to be an integral part of any system to keep my mouth closed using a nasal pillows mask.. Very uncomfortable, but also, doesn't keep MY mouth closed. I need to note. My mouth has a significant overbite, so even with the pressure of this under the chin, its like my mouth is still open due to a gap. (I'd have to have this VERY snug on my neck to do a slight bit of good.) Similarly, when taping my mouth, it gets wet and slowly works apart. People here don't seem very keen on the use of dental appliances, (because I imagine they have found a way for a mask to fit, or the right combination for their unique situation) but I'm thinking that is where I am headed. If there was simply something I could bite down on which would hold my mouth closed, purse my lips, and blocked the air from escaping I would be there.

Anyone have success with something in the mouth that acts like a dam and holds it shut?

J
Customization and support keeps me trying 10 years, not there yet.