S9 Reviews

[dsm]

JNK

I am going to be blunt & say that DreamDiver's reality far exceeds your comments and theory about a machine you don't have & haven't tried.
I am amused at the extent of the critical analysis of the S9 by someone who is in reality describing a phantom and who has no need to buy
the new machine anyway. But keep it coming. It is insightful in other ways



DSM

Cool. So if we're being blunt, I'll just say that I have no idea what you are talking about or how it relates even remotely to my post.

But it was nice hearing from you.



jeff

Jeff,

In the link I posted (to one of DreamDiver's threads), there is a lot of detail that shows what an S9 does & how long it does it for right down to seeing the wave form of the FOT pulses. My point is DreamDiver is showing us what really happens. He has done quite a few excellent, informative & analytical threads on what he is seeing from his own machine. Your critiques & solicitations as to why you wouldn't want one seem be unrelated to the reality we can extract from DreamDivers thread.

Just as an added comment, I would consider that if I went into any theoretical analysis of the PR1 or the new F&P machine & used my theorizing as reasons I wouldn't want one, I would be very fairly open to challenge as to what my purpose was. I readily comment on the ASV machines because I have used the 2 main brands for 2 years and feel I can add value to discussion on the machine. What value are you adding re the S9 ? (value in the sense of informed feedback)

Cheers

DSM

[jnk]

Jeff,

In the link I posted (to one of DreamDiver's threads), there is a lot of detail that shows what an S9 does & how long it does it for right down to seeing the wave form of the FOT pulses. My point is DreamDiver is showing us what really happens. He has done quite a few excellent, informative & analytical threads on what he is seeing from his own machine. Your critiques & solicitations as to why you wouldn't want one seem be unrelated to the reality we can extract from DreamDivers thread.

Just as an added comment, I would consider that if I went into any theoretical analysis of the PR1 or the new F&P machine & used my theorizing as reasons I wouldn't want one, I would be very fairly open to challenge as to what my purpose was. I readily comment on the ASV machines because I have used the 2 main brands for 2 years and feel I can add value to discussion on the machine. What value are you adding re the S9 ? (value in the sense of informed feedback)

Cheers

DSM

Mr. DSM:

I like DreamDiver's posts. He gives good information.

I am pointing out the questions that, in my opinion, need to be answered about the claims made by home-machine manufacturers, not just ResMed, about how effective their machines actually are at differentiating obstructive events from central ones. I believe these are important questions. If you do not, you are free to ignore my posts or to attack them or to flame me as you see fit. Frankly, I have fun either way, because that's just the kind of guy I am.

I will also assume that you do not mean to sound like you are calling me an idiot, or to sound like you calling my motives into question, or to sound like you are attempting to run me out of all threads on the S9. I will make those assumptions because you seem like you usually try hard to be a nice guy.

And I very much look forward to seeing your pictures of what an S9 looks like once it has been torn apart.

jeff

[dsm]

<snip>

I like DreamDiver's posts. He gives good information.

DSM: Fair comment

I am pointing out the questions that, in my opinion, need to be answered about the claims made by home-machine manufacturers, not just ResMed, about how effective their machines actually are at differentiating obstructive events from central ones. I believe these are important questions. If you do not, you are free to ignore my posts or to attack them or to flame me as you see fit. Frankly, I have fun either way, because that's just the kind of guy I am.

I will also assume that you do not mean to sound like you are calling me an idiot, or to sound like you calling my motives into question, or to sound like you are attempting to run me out of all threads on the S9. I will make those assumptions because you seem like you usually try hard to be a nice guy.

DSM: ????? - Jeff look at the title of this thread & think what people might think it means ?

And I very much look forward to seeing your pictures of what an S9 looks like once it has been torn apart.

DSM: That won't happen soon - wife has banned me from buying any more xPAPs - she is complaining repeatedly about the lack of cupboard space

jeff

[jnk]

. . . look at the title of this thread & think what people might think it means ? . . .

My fear is that many will read about the "centrals" and assume it is a scientific certainty that any apnea a home machine labels a central would be labeled such in a sleep lab during a PSG. Maybe. Maybe not. That is more important to ME than the title of the thread. But maybe I am way off base.

Another fear is that many will read threads saying "look how low my AHI is on this machine" and assume that the low self-estimated AHI of any brand of home machine proves that its therapy is more effective than any other machine. Maybe. Maybe not. The rules used for formulating those estimates are important to know in any thread attempting to review a machine on the basis of such numbers.

I think it is important not to swallow the claims of machine manufacturers until their claims have been substantiated. Any manufacturer. From any country.

But I guess I'm in the wrong thread for that kind of discussion. Sorry.

I hereby relinquish the floor to the cheerleaders.

jeff

[dsm]

. . . look at the title of this thread & think what people might think it means ? . . .

<snip>

I hereby relinquish the floor to the cheerleaders.

DSM: So is DreamDiver a cheerleader or a feedback provider ? - I'd prefer to leave it to people who buy & try & provide us with realworld feedback & reviews. DreamDiver is doing just that.

jeff

[Ms.Snuffleupagus]

Another fear is that many will read threads saying "look how low my AHI is on this machine" and assume that the low self-estimated AHI of any brand of home machine proves that its therapy is more effective than any another machine.

jeff

Actually I am enjoying the discussion and your contribution Jeff. I think you make a valid point.

[-SWS]

. . . look at the title of this thread & think what people might think it means ? . . .

My fear is that many will read about the "centrals" and assume it is a scientific certainty that any apnea a home machine labels a central would be labeled such in a sleep lab during a PSG. Maybe. Maybe not. That is more important to ME than the title of the thread. But maybe I am way off base.

Another fear is that many will read threads saying "look how low my AHI is on this machine" and assume that the low self-estimated AHI of any brand of home machine proves that its therapy is more effective than any other machine. Maybe. Maybe not. The rules used for formulating those estimates are important to know in any thread attempting to review a machine on the basis of such numbers.

I think it is important not to swallow the claims of machine manufacturers until their claims have been substantiated. Any manufacturer. From any country.

But I guess I'm in the wrong thread for that kind of discussion. Sorry.

I hereby relinquish the floor to the cheerleaders.

jeff

I would much rather continue hearing your opinions, jnk---which are spot-on at least as often as anyone else's in this thread IMO.

[jnk]

Another fear is that many will read threads saying "look how low my AHI is on this machine" and assume that the low self-estimated AHI of any brand of home machine proves that its therapy is more effective than any another machine.

jeff

Actually I am enjoying the discussion and your contribution Jeff. I think you make a valid point.

Thanks, Ms.Snuffleupagus.

I guess I have dsm to thank for giving me the perfect excuse to keep making the point over and over again like that in this thread, right?

[jnk]

. . . I would much rather continue hearing your opinions, jnk . . .

Thanks, -SWS.

It felt weird for ME to be the one dsm was trying to run out of a thread by calling MY motives into question.

So, what do you think, -SWS--is the S9 THE machine to buy, or is the jury still out? Seriously. Just on what you've read so far.

Or are you wisely withholding judgment until more information becomes available?

jeff

[jnk]

. . . look at the title of this thread & think what people might think it means ? . . .

<snip>

I hereby relinquish the floor to the cheerleaders.

DSM: So is DreamDiver a cheerleader or a feedback provider ? - I'd prefer to leave it to people who buy & try & provide us with realworld feedback & reviews. DreamDiver is doing just that.

jeff

Oh. Sorry for the typo. I meant "cheerleader," singular.

[Uncle_Bob]

Another fear is that many will read threads saying "look how low my AHI is on this machine" and assume that the low self-estimated AHI of any brand of home machine proves that its therapy is more effective than any other machine.
jeff

Um I'm guilty of posting such a thread about my low AHI But i also stated the following ...

Either Resmed have changed their scoring of events or i am getting better therapy with this machine, last night AHI was 0.4
But i have one main concern. I had one obstructive event of 25 secs, my S8 never let an obstructive event go past 12.

Numbers are numbers on these machines and they certainly are not sleep lab quality numbers. Personally I am feeling so much better on this machine so you can keep that as cheerleaders good luck with the eye thing though that does not sound too good, I hope the docs have some answers for ya.

[-SWS]

So, what do you think, -SWS--is the S9 THE machine to buy, or is the jury still out? Seriously. Just on what you've read so far.

So far I'm personally impressed by the preliminaries. I'm seriously considering an S9 Auto for my next machine.

I happen to love the new case style and really would like to have something like that sitting on my nightstand. And I don't normally fall prey to consumer psychology exploits. The hose interface in the back is a non-issue for my nightstand arrangement: plenty of hose length and I never read LCD data during the night. The low sound level sure sounds sleep-conducive as well!

Physical build quality and treatment efficacy achieved by the new algorithm (population based efficacy) fall under this category IMHO:

withholding judgment until more information becomes available

[jnk]

Another fear is that many will read threads saying "look how low my AHI is on this machine" and assume that the low self-estimated AHI of any brand of home machine proves that its therapy is more effective than any other machine.
jeff

Um I'm guilty of posting such a thread about my low AHI But i also stated the following ...

Either Resmed have changed their scoring of events or i am getting better therapy with this machine, last night AHI was 0.4
But i have one main concern. I had one obstructive event of 25 secs, my S8 never let an obstructive event go past 12.

Numbers are numbers on these machines and they certainly are not sleep lab quality numbers. Personally I am feeling so much better on this machine so you can keep that as cheerleaders good luck with the eye thing though that does not sound too good, I hope the docs have some answers for ya.

I have enjoyed your post on the AHI, no guilt that I saw.

Don't confuse me with JeffH. He is the good-looking one with the cornea abrasion. I am the ugly one with retinoshisis in both eyes that the teaching doctors like having their students examine for hours on end. Two more appointments for me next week.

[DreamDiver]

Unlike Phillips-Respironics, Resmed has laid their reputation on the line and said their machine detects central apneas. Respironics calls them 'open airway events'. Does Respironics have confidence in their studies/algorithms - I don't see it. Obviously, Resmed does. How does FOT compare with previous methods of central detection? Comparing the most popular method prior to FOT with FOT, which is more reliable?

(And no, I don't work for Resmed. I'm just jazzed that this machine does what it does, and even more jazzed by the software.)

I'm grateful for the feedback and welcome jnk's skepticism. I was too, in a number of my posts prior to buying it.

Go Team.

[Uncle_Bob]

Don't confuse me with JeffH. He is the good-looking one with the cornea abrasion. I am the ugly one with retinoshisis in both eyes that the teaching doctors like having their students examine for hours on end. Two more appointments for me next week.

Opps sorry Jeff & JeffH