Air Escaping From Mouth?

[SleepyJoeMS]

There's your proof! Keep your jaw shut and no air will leak out. (i can't say anything about the contortions )

Thanks Echo, for the complex yet sound advice As for the contortions, consider yourself fortunate you don't have those images in your head

[rested gal]

I think I try to do that while I'm still awake, but once asleep and relaxed have no control over it.

Exactly. If air is filling the inside of your mouth while awake, you can bet it's doing that when you're asleep too, and is then pushing right on out the lips when you're in the complete relaxation of sleep.

I guess it is not a problem except if it waking me, which I don't think it is... it's just an "awake" observation right now.

Well, actually it can be a problem even without waking you.

Leaks, if they cause arousals without waking you up long enough to be aware of them, sure can interfere over and over again with restful sleep. Bouncing you up repeatedly out of whatever sleep stage you were in at the time, to a lighter stage.

A person can have massive air leaks out the mouth, yet sleep right through them. I've seen that on my own data occasionally, and have seen almost entire nights of tremendous Large Leak situations from data I downloaded for a couple of people I've been helping here in town. When I asked them if the feeling or sound of air gushing out of the mask or out their mouth wakes them up most nights, they usually look puzzled and answer "no." A lot of people can sleep right through an amazing amount of leaks and mouth breathing. Also, a lot of wakeups are so brief they aren't committed to memory and the person never knows they happened.

My mantra about getting good treatment is that it's usually about the "mask, mask, mask."

For you, now it's "download, download, download."

[nomoore]

I can close or open that seal whether my mouth is wide open or my jaw is completely closed. My tongue will relax though while I sleep and the seal will break regardless of whether I'm using a chin strap. Last night with my Activa, mouth taped, I got a leak rate of 28.6 L/min whereas without tape I get a leak rate of anywhere from 35 to 40 L/min.

[rested gal]

I can close or open that seal whether my mouth is wide open or my jaw is completely closed. My tongue will relax though while I sleep and the seal will break regardless of whether I'm using a chin strap. Last night with my Activa, mouth taped, I got a leak rate of 28.6 L/min whereas without tape I get a leak rate of anywhere from 35 to 40 L/min.

Very good point, nomoore, about how the airtight seal formed by the tongue is the key. Just as you described... If the tongue "stays put" in a position that blocks air from sneaking into the mouth from behind (blocks cpap air from detouring into the mouth from behind the tongue) AND prevents inhaling room air, it doesn't matter at all if the mouth is hanging open.

I have the same problem you do. In the relaxation of sleep, my tongue doesn't maintain that seal, even if my mouth is closed.

I think a lot of it has to do with the geometry of the inside of the each individual's mouth. Some can sleep with jaw hanging down, mouth open and not leak air or mouth breathe ever. Their tongue's size in relation to the size of the inside of their mouth, and the position of their tongue when relaxed, all just naturally dam air from either direction, even if the mouth opens. They're lucky, indeed. May they have fleas!!!

[SleepyJoeMS]

I experimented this morning, after waking at 7:30, my longest night ever and discovered what nomoore and Rested Gal said. My mouth and jaw can be wide open and I can conciously make my tongue close the airway. Once I relax that contact, even a little, the dam as RG puts it, opens. Out comes the air. Another observation is, with mouth closed but the the tongue relaxed, I breath through the nose effortlessly. As soon as I open my lips now, because the tongue is not against my palet and throat, I immediately begin breathing thru my mouth. No effort, no thought - the route just changes because the "valve/tongue" is "open." So, I guess that's when the mouth cavity is filling with air, hence the efforts I've read about around here to keep the mouth closed by various means (chin straps, tape, use of ffm, etc.) to avoid those mouth leaks and more importantly mouth breathing, which is not pressurized air.

Well, guess I'm putting together in my words what everyone has said here. At least just being aware of breathing mechanics may be helpful in the long run. How I have taken for granted the effortless, usually automatic act of breathing until now. Go figure

Thanks all. Happy breathing. Joe

[Hawthorne]

If not fleas, Rested gal, then bedbugs!! We are bad! No, we are "Mr. Green"!