Mask stupidity

[jnk...]

So according to that chart it is saying that sleeping on your back is the best but higher risk of snoring. So if you are using a CPAP machine can you sleep on your back or is the side better? I am asking as I am waiting on the results of my home sleep study. I currently am either a side or back sleeper but primarily on my side (due to the fact that my girlfriend will usually push me over to my side when I am on my back due to my snoring). So I know I am an active sleeper and find that it is usually my side or back where I end up the most. So I am wondering if I do get diagnosed and get a CPAP to use would it be ok to sleep on my back? It seems I see a lot of people on the forums prefer side sleeping with CPAP?

As a general rule, an attempt is made to titrate a PAP user in a way that will keep the user safely and effectively asleep all night in any position. That is the goal. And that is why many sleep docs tend to add a cm or so to an Rx to cover the occasional rough night, in the case of plain-vanilla OSA, anyway. If a person does OK with a machine set to auto mode, that allows the machine to vary pressure to meet moment-to-moment needs all night. If a person does not do well with an auto or has other pressure sensitivities, sleep position can matter, though. My point is that most all of us are likely to end up in sleep positions that we are unaware of. Heck, I used to sleep standing up with my forehead up against a dangerous machine in my pretreatment days. Sleep habits change for many of us in multiple ways once our PAP treatment is optimized and we settle into a better sleep routine.

I'm not a pro.

[jnk...]

I really have no skin in the how you sleep game, I was simply providing some information to dispute that current mask designs are suitable for 99% of the population.

How do you get 99% if 7% are front sleepers? . . . .

TASmart's post was, I believe, made to dispute the 99% claim that was made by someone else, not to support it.

The trick is either to find a mask that works great for you, or to find a way to modify a mask so that it works for you--a long-respected tradition on this forum. Many have found that finding that one magical mask that works individually is the key to comfortable treatment. For some of us, it takes many masks to find the right one. Others of us get the right one right out of the gate. But getting good treatment with a mask that doesn't work for that one user is pert-near impossible, no matter how many of the general population may love the mask.

[MaxINTJ]

As a general rule, an attempt is made to titrate a PAP user in a way that will keep the user safely and effectively asleep all night in any position. That is the goal. And that is why many sleep docs tend to add a cm or so to an Rx to cover the occasional rough night, in the case of plain-vanilla OSA, anyway. If a person does OK with a machine set to auto mode, that allows the machine to vary pressure to meet moment-to-moment needs all night. If a person does not do well with an auto or has other pressure sensitivities, sleep position can matter, though. My point is that most all of us are likely to end up in sleep positions that we are unaware of. Heck, I used to sleep standing up with my forehead up against a dangerous machine in my pretreatment days. Sleep habits change for many of us in multiple ways once our PAP treatment is optimized and we settle into a better sleep routine.

I'm not a pro.

During my first study and my titration they had to wake me up and tell me to sleep on my back to get readings - even then I didn't do it very long and ended up rolling over, but I guess it was long enough to get whatever readings they wanted.

[MaxINTJ]

I really have no skin in the how you sleep game, I was simply providing some information to dispute that current mask designs are suitable for 99% of the population.

How do you get 99% if 7% are front sleepers? . . . .

TASmart's post was, I believe, made to dispute the 99% claim that was made by someone else, not to support it.

Quite correct, my bad.

MaxINTJ -1

[jnk...]

As a general rule, an attempt is made to titrate a PAP user in a way that will keep the user safely and effectively asleep all night in any position. That is the goal. And that is why many sleep docs tend to add a cm or so to an Rx to cover the occasional rough night, in the case of plain-vanilla OSA, anyway. If a person does OK with a machine set to auto mode, that allows the machine to vary pressure to meet moment-to-moment needs all night. If a person does not do well with an auto or has other pressure sensitivities, sleep position can matter, though. My point is that most all of us are likely to end up in sleep positions that we are unaware of. Heck, I used to sleep standing up with my forehead up against a dangerous machine in my pretreatment days. Sleep habits change for many of us in multiple ways once our PAP treatment is optimized and we settle into a better sleep routine.

I'm not a pro.

During my first study and my titration they had to wake me up and tell me to sleep on my back to get readings - even then I didn't do it very long and ended up rolling over, but I guess it was long enough to get whatever readings they wanted.

That is, I believe, standard operating procedure. If you walked away from the titration with an Rx that wouldn't get you through supine REM, you would be in a world of hurt if you ended up HAVING to sleep on your back a few nights because of sickness, injury, or hospital stay. A hospital is a dangerous enough place for relatively healthy people who manage to sleep well--let alone someone trying to heal from surgery who now can't breathe or sleep. If I ruled the world (help us all!), I would put every patient on PAP post-surgery for the duration of the hospital stay, whether that patient was considered to be OSA/UARS or not! Reason number 427 why no one lets me rule the world.

[Janknitz]

I have given the Amara View 2 weeks of trial, and if anything is going to make me give up, it's the complete lack of mask choices.

Have you only tried two masks? There are dozens to try, but it's a bit like playing Cinderella--you have to keep trying and keep trying and keep trying until you find THE mask that works for you. There's no such thing as "giving up".

But realize there's no such thing as a "perfect" mask. Don't let perfect be the enemy in the good. You may have to settle for "good enough".

[DonO]

Have you looked at the TAP PAP? I have not used it, but the hose position seems to be what you are having issues with and the TAP PAP goes over the head, which may help.

[jnk...]

. . . Don't let perfect be the enemy in the good. You may have to settle for "good enough".

I agree, but depends. I would also argue not to let the good-enough be the enemy of the perfect.

As a, ahem, perfect example: In my marriage, my wife had to settle for "good enough." I, on the other hand, consider her to be perfect.

Just sayin'.

[MaxINTJ]

I have given the Amara View 2 weeks of trial, and if anything is going to make me give up, it's the complete lack of mask choices.

Have you only tried two masks? There are dozens to try, but it's a bit like playing Cinderella--you have to keep trying and keep trying and keep trying until you find THE mask that works for you. There's no such thing as "giving up".

But realize there's no such thing as a "perfect" mask. Don't let perfect be the enemy in the good. You may have to settle for "good enough".

Well yes, 2 masks. The ONLY ONE with a top mount hose is actually plenty good enough - up to about 15 pressure - then my mouth blows open (and pressure goes to 25 every night). Chin strap only changed the loud rushing of air to a loud rushing of air with farting noises made by my lips flapping.

The View is the smallest mask considered to be a FFM and it is WAY too big - especially at the front. I really don't need 6" of plastic hanging off the front of my face. Any other FFM is going to be even larger and more intrusive.

There is no point at all in trying any of the larger masks.

[MaxINTJ]

Have you looked at the TAP PAP? I have not used it, but the hose position seems to be what you are having issues with and the TAP PAP goes over the head, which may help.

That mask does not solve anything, as the hose is still mounted at the front. Instead of a 6" protrusion maybe the TAP PAP would be 3" or so, but it also has the protrusion the entire length of the face.

[Bertha deBlues]

. . . Don't let perfect be the enemy in the good. You may have to settle for "good enough".

I agree, but depends. I would also argue not to let the good-enough be the enemy of the perfect.

As a, ahem, perfect example: In my marriage, my wife had to settle for "good enough." I, on the other hand, consider her to be perfect.

Just sayin'.

Awww, you're a keeper!!

[jnk...]

. . . Don't let perfect be the enemy in the good. You may have to settle for "good enough".

I agree, but depends. I would also argue not to let the good-enough be the enemy of the perfect.

As a, ahem, perfect example: In my marriage, my wife had to settle for "good enough." I, on the other hand, consider her to be perfect.

Just sayin'.

Awww, you're a keeper!!

Thanks. I'll let her know that I have your vote. Just in case she's on the fence.

[A MESS]

Problems-problems--you may start out on your back or whatever, but who knows how you will wind up. Dont think any of the manufacturers are doing a great job, or else we would not be moaning about it. Manufacturers--listen up!

[Bertha deBlues]

Problems-problems--you may start out on your back or whatever, but who knows how you will wind up. Dont think any of the manufacturers are doing a great job, or else we would not be moaning about it. Manufacturers--listen up!

There are "contact us" buttons on some manufacturer websites. You could let them know directly what you want. Can't hurt to try.

Philips Respironics: https://www.resmed.com/us/en/consumer.html
Resmed: https://www.resmed.com/us/en/consumer.html

[MaxINTJ]

Problems-problems--you may start out on your back or whatever, but who knows how you will wind up. Dont think any of the manufacturers are doing a great job, or else we would not be moaning about it. Manufacturers--listen up!

There are "contact us" buttons on some manufacturer websites. You could let them know directly what you want. Can't hurt to try.

Philips Respironics: https://www.resmed.com/us/en/consumer.html
Resmed: https://www.resmed.com/us/en/consumer.html

They don't want to be contacted - they list no online or email contact method.

I don't have hours to spend on the phone and then not have any record of anything they say.