Jimmycrackhorn wrote:I don't know. I'm just still do scared it's not working. I'm filed with anxiety right now and I'm tired. My eyes are not as bad as were yesterday I don't think, but I'm not sure. When I just laid down to relax a bit since I've been high wired today I just felt so tired. And I'm worried the machine is not giving me the air and oxygen I need for me to recover properly so that I'll never wake up fully again.
Someone tell me I'm over-reacting.
You are over-reacting.
That said, it's not uncommon to over-react when you've been doing the CPAP thing for a long time, but you don't notice any improvement in how you feel. However I think you are dealing with some additional problems that are due to the anxiety getting the best of you.
In particular, it's very hard to get a really good night's sleep when you are anxious. And then if you add in active worrying about the CPAP machine not "giving you the air and oxygen you need", that aggravates things.
I know you've been at this for three years, but you won't start feeling genuinely rested until you are sleeping
well with the mask. And what I mean by sleeping
well is this: You can go to bed and put the mask on without any sense of dread. You fall asleep with the mask on within about 20 minutes of going to bed. You remember few or no wakes during the night, and if there are wakes, they're spaced out at 90+ minute intervals AND they're short and you don't have any trouble getting back to sleep. And you get enough total sleep (all WITH the mask on) every day. How much sleep? That depends. Most people need around 7-8 hours to feel rested. Some people need a bit more, and others do fine with getting 6-7 hours of sleep.
feel asleep so good last night and here comes another night and I just want to fall asleep easily again and be at peace. I can't be doing these drugs especially off I'm not even sure the machine is giving me the full recovery I need.
The more you worry about the quality of your sleep, the harder it becomes to actually get high quality sleep.
The CPAP machine is not going to "give you the full recovery" from
bad sleep that you crave: The CPAP machine fixes your OSA when you use it; it does not fix
bad sleep caused by things
other than untreated OSA. With time, good quality sleep with the CPAP will allow your body to heal the damage that has accumulated from the years of untreated OSA. But the CPAP is not going to fix any other problems that may be causing
bad sleep issues.
In particular, the CPAP is not going to magically fix long term problems with insomnia that are caused by things other than untreated OSA. It's not going to fix anxiety. It may be time to revisit the issue of whether the Ativan is properly treating anxiety issues you are dealing with. It may also be worth considering the insomnia as a separate (but equal) sleep problem from the OSA.
You need to consider what you are willing to do to treat and manage the insomnia. There are two main approaches to treating serious long term insomnia problems: Sleeping medication and cognitive behavior therapy for insomnia. They're not mutually exclusive and for some people a combined approach may work better than either medication or CBT-I alone do. But they both take time and effort. There's just no magic pill that instantly fixes the host of problems that lead long term problems with insomnia.
It's bad when the sleep doctor says that I am getting great readings and I just don't trust his judgement or think that maybe I'm different some how and that I'm some special case that isn't recovering and responding the same to treatment as everyone else.
You are an individual, not a statistic. And you are what is known in the world of statistics as
an outlier. I say that as someone else who is an outlier when it comes to CPAP therapy.
The problem with being an outlier is that therapies and medical advice are geared towards what works for the most people. And when you don't respond in the expected way, the docs don't have a lot of ideas on what to do next.
But I will suggest this: At your next appointment with the sleep doc, move beyond talking about the CPAP therapy. Accept that the CPAP is doing its job since your treated AHI is in the good range, and start talking about the repeated night time wakes
as its own issue. Don't "blame" the wakes on the CPAP machine, and don't try to say that the wakes are caused by "lack of oxygen" when the evidence is that the CPAP machine is doing its job of treating the OSA. Ask the doc,
"What can I do to reduce the number of wakes during the night?" and the
listen to advice the doc actually gives you in regards to the insomnia problem.
I'm just so tired and I'm scared and I'm tired of being scared.
"Tired" is tied to both the insomnia and the feeling of being scared all the time. You need to work on addressing both the insomnia and the fear. The CPAP can't magically fix either of those problems.
Is being on year 3 a noob??
Not really. But when you've been at something like CPAP for years and you still don't feel good, it can sure feel like you're a newbie.
I'll try 12cm tonight. I'm afraid those minor bumps are adding up such luck which is causing my overall tiredness.
So zeroing in better is HOPEFULLY going to help.
How often do you change the settings on your machine? Every few days? Every few weeks? Once in a while?
SOMETHING tells me everything is going to work out but there's still a huge fear that it won't.
And I feel like I'm on crunch time. 3 years of bad therapy is not a good thing. I'm worried about the permanent damage being done.
Even though you've been at this for three years, I think you still expect CPAP to be a magic bullet that will fix
all your sleep problems.
But that is an UNREASONABLE expectation for CPAP. CPAP fixes OSA and only OSA. CPAP does not do anything to directly fix insomnia caused by things other than OSA. CPAP does not fix anxiety problems. CPAP does not fix anything other than OSA.
Your data indicates that the CPAP is doing its job in terms of preventing most of your OSA events from occurring. Your data also indicates that you are not sleeping for long periods of time between wakes. Your narratives indicate that you have real problems with sleep maintenance issues and may have problems with sleep initiation issues. Your narratives indicate that you have real problems with anxiety.
It's time to start asking yourself this question:
What is causing the insomnia and the anxiety? The answer is NOT
bad CPAP therapy because your CPAP is doing its job. But in spite of the OSA being treated, your body and brain are not yet getting the high quality sleep you crave. And it's going to take some digging on your part to figure out what's causing the
bad sleep that continues to plague you.
That hour between 5:45 and 7 whatever, ya. I woke up for a bit. Then after a relaxing shower went back to bed.
Question: How do you
feel about that wake, the shower, and you're going back to bed?
If you're angry that you woke up (yet again), resented the need to take a shower, but understand that it helped, and when back to bed full of worry and anxiety in spite of the shower, that's negative thinking that is likely making the insomnia problems worse.
On the other hand, if you woke up and decided that since you weren't likely to get back to sleep quickly, you might as well get up and take a shower, and after the shower relaxed you, you made a positive decision to go back to bed, that's positive thinking. And, in the long run, positive thinking helps a lot when it comes to dealing with insomnia issues.
Man. Someone just give me some gd words of wisdom or encouragement so I can get through another night.
I just want so badly to come out the other side normal again.
This fight has been too long and I'm growing weary.
I know I'm sounding like a broken record, but .... it sounds like you're caught in a nasty feedback loop:
- The anxiety triggers the worries that the CPAP therapy is not working and the the worrying and anxiety makes the insomnia get worse.
- And the insomnia leaves you feeling exhausted in the daytime, which increases the worrying about the CPAP therapy and makes the anxiety get worse.
In order to break that feedback loop, I think you need to start looking at the big picture with open eyes, rather than trying to pin all your ongoing sleep/anxiety problems on OSA/CPAP. One starting point is to ask yourself these kinds of questions:
1) What's causing the anxiety? Did it exist before your OSA diagnosis? Has it gotten worse or better since starting CPAP? What are you willing to do to properly treat the anxiety? Is the Atvian working well enough to treat the anxiety without triggering side effects that adversely affect your sleep? Should a change in medication be considered?
2) What ---other than OSA and/or CPAP--- might be causing the insomnia problems? What do your sleep habits look like? Have you tried some basic sleep hygiene techniques? Are you willing to put some effort into CBT-I, either on your own (there are a lot of self-help books out there) or with the aid of a therapist? Are you willing to consider long term use of sleeping pills if they actually work for your?
3) What do you think defines a
good night's sleep? Sometimes we create more problems for ourselves by chasing an impossible standard for
good night's sleep when we ought to be aiming for a more reasonable standard for
good night's sleep.
4) What can you do to increase your trust in the data that says the machine is treating your OSA? If you learned to trust your machine's data, then you might find it easier so that you can learn to relax and let the machine do its job while your brain and body do their job of getting to sleep and staying asleep long enough to wake up feeling better in the morning.
5) Are there other health problems that are going on that may be exacerbating your sleep problems?
