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General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
Slats
 
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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby Slats on Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:49 pm

Well I was imprecise, in my phrasing; I had a few leaks with the Respironics as compared to huge leaks with the Airsense 10 with heated tube, so I felt you were getting into a semantic contest, rather than addressing the issue.

The difference in the 3 weeks I have been using the Airsense 10, has been profound, in that I was so pleased that I been able to use the nasal pillows, when I discovering paper taping as a solution, from this excellent message source. I have a terrific sleep tech at my HMO, and he thought my nasal pillows were the source of the leakage.

I am a true believer when it comes to using my cpap , and again I am grateful to this message board.
I have experienced major changes in my physical and mental health as a result .

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby palerider on Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:54 pm

Slats wrote:Well I was imprecise, in my phrasing; I had a few leaks with the Respironics as compared to huge leaks with the Airsense 10 with heated tube, so I felt you were getting into a semantic contest, rather than addressing the issue.

are you aware that the two machines report leaks totally different?

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby Slats on Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:57 pm

palerider wrote:
Slats wrote:Well I was imprecise, in my phrasing; I had a few leaks with the Respironics as compared to huge leaks with the Airsense 10 with heated tube, so I felt you were getting into a semantic contest, rather than addressing the issue.

are you aware that the two machines report leaks totally different?


No. Can you kindly tell me the difference. BTW, I used sleepyhead for the Airsense 10 , as well as getting reports from Resmed my air, which analyzes your sleep.

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby Pugsy on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:08 pm

Slats wrote:Can you kindly tell me the difference.


When you have some time you might do a bit of reading.
viewtopic/t88983/Pugsys-PointersSleepyHead-Tutorial-and-TX-Hints.html
3rd post down from the top explains the various machine leak reporting.

Slats wrote:reports from Resmed my air, which analyzes your sleep.


You are aware that nothing you are using knows if you are actually asleep or not...aren't you?
MyAir attempts to "score" your sleep based on hours of "sleep" and how many times you turned the machine off and back on again and factors in leaks a bit....but nothing anywhere really knows if you were asleep or not.
Keep the mask on all night for 7 hours and don't turn the machine off or back on and stay awake all night long and you still get a perfect "score" of 100.

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby Slats on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:30 pm

Pugsy wrote:
Slats wrote:Can you kindly tell me the difference.


When you have some time you might do a bit of reading.
viewtopic/t88983/Pugsys-PointersSleepyHead-Tutorial-and-TX-Hints.html
3rd post down from the top explains the various machine leak reporting.

Slats wrote:reports from Resmed my air, which analyzes your sleep.


You are aware that nothing you are using knows if you are actually asleep or not...aren't you?
MyAir attempts to "score" your sleep based on hours of "sleep" and how many times you turned the machine off and back on again and factors in leaks a bit....but nothing anywhere really knows if you were asleep or not.
Keep the mask on all night for 7 hours and don't turn the machine off or back on and stay awake all night long and you still get a perfect "score" of 100.


I totally agree about Myair inaccuracy. I only signed up so my sleep tech could access my data, because Sleepyhead , which I use religiously, kept telling me I was leaking too much. I don't rely on the "happy face icon"son the Airsense 10, but even the darn "frowning icon "came on the machine, because I was leaking much.

I will read the above link and talk you for your help.

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby Pugsy on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:47 pm

If Mr Frowny shows up on the ResMed machine then it means for at least 30% (or more) your leaks were above the 24 L/min line.
Now how bad "bad" is kinda depends on how far your go above that 24 L/min line and how long you stay there.
The further you go over the 24 L/min mark the worse it is but the machine actually does a fairly decent job of things until you go past 30 L/min. Over that and things start getting iffy and the further you go the iffier it gets.

I have no idea why the paper tape stays in place with the Respironics machine and doesn't with the ResMed because when using nasal pillows...if the pillows are staying in place then no air should be blowing on the tape to loosen it...dry or moist.

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby Slats on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:03 pm

Pugsy wrote:If Mr Frowny shows up on the ResMed machine then it means for at least 30% (or more) your leaks were above the 24 L/min line.
Now how bad "bad" is kinda depends on how far your go above that 24 L/min line and how long you stay there.
The further you go over the 24 L/min mark the worse it is but the machine actually does a fairly decent job of things until you go past 30 L/min. Over that and things start getting iffy and the further you go the iffier it gets.

I have no idea why the paper tape stays in place with the Respironics machine and doesn't with the ResMed because when using nasal pillows...if the pillows are staying in place then no air should be blowing on the tape to loosen it...dry or moist.


Oh no, as far as I am concerned, you are my cpap guru, so I defer to you. I have more details to add.
A big difference is that , with the Airsense 10, I was filling the water container to max and almost all the water was gone in the morning, plus I was using the Climatecontrol heated tube.I did adjust the humidity control.With the Respironics, I use a regular hose,I fill it up the tank almost to max, turn dial to 1, and hardly any water is gone in morning.

I must have a setting on, that I am unaware of. I know that the tape is very moist with the Airsense 10. I happily slept through the night with the old Respironics and had and tape was still firmly adhering to my lips. I did try a regular tube ( not heated) with Airsense, but 50% leaks, waking in the night and very moist tape .

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby Pugsy on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:19 pm

I just can't imagine how moisture is getting from the nose to the mouth/tape if the nasal pillows are staying in place like they should.

Setting of 1 on a Respironics humidifier with a regular hose isn't much added moisture and of course the ResMed with the heated hose is going to crank out more moisture...but I don't see how that moisturized air is getting on the tape.
Something doesn't add up.
Air goes up your nose and down the airway and I don't see how it is making it to the lips/taped area.
I can see the tape loosening if the moisturized air gets blown on the tape but how it gets blown on the tape doesn't make any sense if the nasal pillows are staying in place. No air should be exiting the nostril area in the first place.

Only thing I can think of is that mask movement (pillows in the nose) is allowing moisturized air to blow on the taped area and the tape comes loose and you not only have nasal pillow movement leak but then mouth opening leak on top of a little mask movement leak.
I would suspect that with the Respironics machine there is also still a little bit of mask movement leaking going on but since the air is drier then the tape stays in place better so no mouth breathing leak.

Do you like the added humidity available with the new ResMed?
You know you can make humidity and hose air temp separate if you wish. If it is using almost all the water it may be set on Auto which is a lot of moisture. You can set the hose air temp and humidity totally separate if you wish. Choose a lower humidity setting similar to the setting of 1 on the Respironics and still have the warmth if you want it.
Or just use a non heated hose and set the humidity to a lower number.

I think I would still watch the leaks though...if the tape is in place then any leak you see are mask movement leaks and they may need to be worked on.

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby Slats on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:31 pm

Pugsy wrote:I just can't imagine how moisture is getting from the nose to the mouth/tape if the nasal pillows are staying in place like they should.

Setting of 1 on a Respironics humidifier with a regular hose isn't much added moisture and of course the ResMed with the heated hose is going to crank out more moisture...but I don't see how that moisturized air is getting on the tape.
Something doesn't add up.
Air goes up your nose and down the airway and I don't see how it is making it to the lips/taped area.
I can see the tape loosening if the moisturized air gets blown on the tape but how it gets blown on the tape doesn't make any sense if the nasal pillows are staying in place. No air should be exiting the nostril area in the first place.

Only thing I can think of is that mask movement (pillows in the nose) is allowing moisturized air to blow on the taped area and the tape comes loose and you not only have nasal pillow movement leak but then mouth opening leak on top of a little mask movement leak.
I would suspect that with the Respironics machine there is also still a little bit of mask movement leaking going on but since the air is drier then the tape stays in place better so no mouth breathing leak.

Do you like the added humidity available with the new ResMed?
You know you can make humidity and hose air temp separate if you wish. If it is using almost all the water it may be set on Auto which is a lot of moisture. You can set the hose air temp and humidity totally separate if you wish. Choose a lower humidity setting similar to the setting of 1 on the Respironics and still have the warmth if you want it.
Or just use a non heated hose and set the humidity to a lower number.

I think I would still watch the leaks though...if the tape is in place then any leak you see are mask movement leaks and they may need to be worked on.


I got the heated tube, because of the rainout in my tubing. Now it is much warmer, so I don't have this as an issue. Also, I noticed, the Airsense 10 is much more aggressive in increasing pressure.My pressure went from 10 to 15. Of course my total ahi decreased from 2 to .5.

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby Pugsy on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:52 pm

ResMed machines have a different algorithm in auto mode than Respironics machines.
So the fact that your pressures aren't the same doesn't surprise me. I would be more surprised to hear that the pressures in apap mode matched each other.
Too many variables to really get all excited about where the machine goes.
The exhale relief between the 2 brands is different.
The algorithms are different.
We don't sleep the same each night either.

ResMed machines just respond differently.
Especially if you are having many Flow limitations...ResMed's get more aggressive towards FLs than Respironics seems to...at least from my experience.

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby palerider on Sun Mar 19, 2017 10:07 pm

Slats wrote:reports from Resmed my air, which analyzes your sleep.

er, no, no it doesn't.. myair is sop to people that like to play games on their phones. making meaningless "scores" and giving worthless 'awards'.

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby chunkyfrog on Sun Mar 19, 2017 10:11 pm

I suspect someone at Resmed thought this would prevent some people from getting Sleepyhead.
:twisted:

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby palerider on Sun Mar 19, 2017 10:19 pm

chunkyfrog wrote:I suspect someone at Resmed thought this would prevent some people from getting Sleepyhead.
:twisted:

only those that don't know about it ;)

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Re: paper tape leakage with Resmed Airsense 10, heated tube

Postby Hannibal 2 on Mon Mar 20, 2017 7:03 am

Which tape are you using? Micropore or something else?

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