Help ! Do I have very bad sleep apnea ? 49% Sp02

[BlizzardUK]

Hi all, my first post here.

I know I have undiagnosed sleep apnea as I have been falling asleep all the time, and I filmed myself the whole night and I don't breathe until every 30 seconds or so, my body pushes and pushes until air is released and I touch my nose and face. This repeats the whole night every 30 to 40 seconds. I will post the video on a private Youtube link if anyone wants to see it.

So I went and bought myself a CMS50I Oximeter to try and bypass some of the doctor waiting. I just checked my first results and they are below, sadly I took the finger probe off in my sleep so I only have about 4 hours of data. Can anyone tell how bad it is ? I haven't heard anyone getting down to 49% for Sp02, it has freaked me out a bit as I heard 70% was critical and an emergency. It recorded many hours without my finger in the probe so I am unsure if this affects the average results or not.

Any info or advice other than showing future results to the doc ? I have not been given cpap or seen a doctor or any lab test at the moment.

See below...........

[Sleeprider]

SpO2 desaturation usually looks at events below 88% as a level of concern. I don't know that a diagnosis of sleep apnea should be made (on a forum) from pulse-ox data alone, but your low oxygen levels are pretty compelling. This is a matter you should take up with your doctor as a matter of some considerable urgency so you can get the help you need. What are you waiting for?

[ChicagoGranny]

doctor waiting

Make sure not to sleep on your back until you get a CPAP. Obstructive sleep apnea is often much worse on the back because gravity is directly pulling the soft palate and the tongue into the airway.

I will post the video on a private Youtube link if anyone wants to see it.

TMI. We believe you.

BTW, you never mentioned what your symptoms are.

[BlizzardUK]

Sorry for the message, I seemed a bit desperate there, just was shocked when I saw it say 49%, after hearing other apnea sufferers saying their doctors told them it was bad at 70%.

I am going to see my doc, but in the UK things take a long time, so I bought the finger pulse test to try and jump the queue and not need a night study which can take 6 months to come through. I wanted to collate a weeks worth of data first. The reason I didn't see a doc earlier. after feeling symptoms for many months, is because I have suffered with this before and lost 5 stone and felt better again. I was hoping to lose enough weight to not need a machine, but the lack of energy this time is making it hard to do anything. I think this time I have put on so much weight that the apnea is controlling me rather than the other way around before. Now I can't sit in a seat without falling asleep, before I could cope as long as concentrated. I can't drive now either as within 15 minutes I need to pull over and nap for 10 minutes.

My main day symptoms are.......

I feel like a walking zombie, my eyes burn, I can't play video games as I either fall asleep in the chair or my concentration doesn't allow me. I find it hard to watch a movie and not rewind many times due to missing things. If I lie in bed with a mobile or tablet device to use it often falls out of my hand on the floor within 5 minutes of lying down. I have no interest in sex when this time last year I was really high on libido. I sleep through 2 alarms. I wake up with a headache and have black zigzag lines in my eyesight. I sit on the edge of the bed to get up but often drift off. I sit in my armchair to eat breakfast and read the paper, I am asleep by page 4 of the paper. I eat my main meal and am asleep if I try and read the paper after. I need to pee twice a night, and if I nap in the evening I wake up urgently to pee, even if just been 30 minutes asleep and been to the toilet soon before. My brother in law, who also has sleep apnea, tried to wake me up the other day as I fell to sleep during the afternoon, he said he couldn't wake me and when I did wake up I supposedly stared at him wide red eyed while still asleep, it took me a minute to realise what was happening and be fully conscious. That was a very strange experience.

As mentioned, my brother in law has sleep apnea and a CPAP, so he has been pressuring me to get one. I would buy one straight away if we didn't have to get a prescription here in the UK.

[ChicagoGranny]

Everything you have presented points to sleep apnea. Wish we could help with that six months lag.

Any chance to buy a used machine and ancillary supplies without a doctor's prescription?

We can help you titrate the machine. But you do need to get a machine that is approved by the expert forum members.

[Sleeprider]

I think you have already drawn a reasonable conclusion. Have you considered buying something here http://www.secondwindcpap.com/ like the PRS1 DS560HS Auto that would help you bridge the gap until you can get in the queue? It would treat most obstructive apnea and give you data to suggest if the problem lies in a more complex area. They ship internationally, and that would get you on the road to recovery if you can also get an appropriate mask together. Best option would be a responsive medical system that diagnoses and puts appropriate equipment into your hands, but you gotta do what you gotta do. It appears your health is in the balance here.

[BlizzardUK]

Thanks guys, I might buy one of those 2nd hand machines to bridge the gap.

You mention the PRS1 DS560HS Auto, does this mean it will automatically adjust to what pressure I need ? As I have no idea what pressure to put it on. Would it come with a new mask or where would I get such a item ?

[Sleeprider]

Thanks guys, I might buy one of those 2nd hand machines to bridge the gap.

You mention the PRS1 DS560HS Auto, does this mean it will automatically adjust to what pressure I need ? As I have no idea what pressure to put it on. Would it come with a new mask or where would I get such a item ?

The DS560HS is an auto CPAP and will help you self titrate. It is fully data capable so as you use it, we can help you optimize treatment. Be aware that about 15% of apnea patients may have complex apnea, and require a different solution. The data from this machine will quickly reveal that problem, but at this point, I'd just go for it. You really should not subject your heart to that kind of stress every night. That is a top of the line machine, and will do a great job for the majority of obstructive sleep apnea patients.

The machine is not a magic bullet. You still have to find a mask interface you can use, and get comfortable with the therapy. It can be easy or challenging depending on how you approach it. If you work to use the machine every time you sleep, and use the data it provides to optimize the settings, it can be very very effective. The potential difficulties in adjusting to pressure, air leaks and disruptions to sleep are the down-side. Everyone has their own journey, but I'd suggest with the problems indicated in your first post, you will find your first restful sleep in years, and do very well.

[biz64]

Thanks guys, I might buy one of those 2nd hand machines to bridge the gap.

You mention the PRS1 DS560HS Auto, does this mean it will automatically adjust to what pressure I need ? As I have no idea what pressure to put it on. Would it come with a new mask or where would I get such a item ?

The same place has masks available also. Set the pressures at 5 for the min. and 20 for the max. Once you use it and gather some data you can fine tune it. I'm a respiratory therapist and judging from what you have written, it definitely sounds like sleep apnea IMHO. Good luck!

[BleepingBeauty]

I believe secondwindcpap requires a prescription (like all online dealers). I think the OP's best bet for buying without a script would be a machine on offer here on the forum or on a site like CriagsList.

[HoseCrusher]

Before you get totally bummed out... I would suggest you run the test again.

Your report showed you had artifacts over 50% of the time. This means that your results are not that reliable.

You may still have issues, but your doctor will be more responsive if you have data that is more accurate.

[BlizzardUK]

Thanks everyone.

Does it matter if I am a nose or mouth breather in my sleep to what I do with the machine or mask ? Or do they all go through the nose ? Do I presume the feeling is air being blown up the nose, is it uncomfortable ?

HoseCrusher, cam you give me some advice with the readings, where does it show artefacts ? I am unsure what to look at. I did another test tonight and got the below results. The level where the Sp02 goes back to normal at 9.20 is where I got up for the toilet for 20 minutes. I am also worried about my low pulse rate, it says I go down to 50 bpm, I am 32 stone (450lbs), that can't be right for a guy my size.

[Julie]

HC can answer your oximeter questions, but as to the air pressure, etc... your awareness of air being blown in at all will fade quickly, both for each night (often within a few minutes) and long term to the point where many wake up and think the machine's broken! There's nothing uncomfortable about it, just a new sensation, but even that may be mild depending on your scripted pressure and a machine feature called Ramp can be used (tho' most of us don't bother beyond the first week). It lets you set a time (10-40 mins) during which your machine accelerates the pressure from so low that you may feel starved for air (you don't have to set it that low tho') to the prescribed level... though during that time you won't be fully treated of course, but may be a little more comfortable. I personally quit that within a few days.

And the mask is very important - air will enter your nose and/or mouth depending on your normal breathing pattern (don't forget - you're not expected to adjust your breathing to the machine, but the other way around) and whether you normally breathe through your nose alone or mouth breathe (even if only on exhalation) due to habit, back sleeping - a big no-no as it provokes more apneas - that allows your mouth to fall open, or nasal blockage of some kind. If you can't adjust to a nasal mask alone, e.g. if air escapes from your mouth when being delivered by Cpap, you're losing therapy, so a 'full face' mask is usually the answer as even if you mouth breathe when it's on, you won't lose it to the breeze. Full face masks are just those that extend a bit lower than nasal ones to cover your mouth - the only type of mask that covers a lot of the face is called a total mask, and few people actually use them. But if you only end up needing a nasal mask, the small amount of air going in will not affect your nose as such in any negative (uncomfortable) way.

[ChicagoGranny]

Do I presume the feeling is air being blown up the nose

There is not air being blown up the nose. (Unless you have the mask on upside down. ) The amount of air and the speed of the air passing through your nose with each breath does not change with CPAP.

The CPAP process creates a very low pressure. You may initially feel like you are breathing against this pressure. If you don't panic and take a positive attitude that it is good for your health (It really is.), then very soon you will not notice the pressure. It quickly becomes the new normal.

[Pugsy]

Are you a "mouth breather" out of physical necessity like you have chronic nasal congestion issues that can't be cleared up or do you normally breathe through mainly your nose during the day?
If you mouth breathe out of necessity then you might as well look at a full face mask to start with (covers nose and mouth) but if you normally can breathe through your nose just fine without issues you might be able to use a nasal interface only mask.