Not Trying to Stir Up Trouble...But...

[OSAHell]

Just want to add a comment. I'm not an english person and didn't realize what tonsils were until I saw the ChicagoGranny's picture... (thanks ChicagoGranny by the way), I really thought it was something in the nose, sorry my bad! Anyway, my previous comments still stand but now I can share my experience with tonsils removal!

When I was a very little child (don't remember anything of it) I had my tonsils removed because my mother was really afraid that I would choke to death in my sleep! Nearly 40 years later, I was diagnose with sleep apnea... Low range moderate sleep apnea in the first sleep study. And I'm pretty sure I had it for at least 10 years and it impacted my life, slowly but constantly over the years, very badly.

[corvallisgrace75]

Just want to add a comment. I'm not an english person and didn't realize what tonsils were until I saw the ChicagoGranny's picture... (thanks ChicagoGranny by the way), I really thought it was something in the nose, sorry my bad! Anyway, my previous comments still stand but now I can share my experience with tonsils removal!

When I was a very little child (don't remember anything of it) I had my tonsils removed because my mother was really afraid that I would choke to death in my sleep! Nearly 40 years later, I was diagnose with sleep apnea... Low range moderate sleep apnea in the first sleep study. And I'm pretty sure I had it for at least 10 years and it impacted my life, slowly but constantly over the years, very badly.

Thank you for the laugh. No offense at all. I'm trying to imagine my tonsils inside my nose and it's giving me a good giggle. It's certainly not impossible to have had one's tonsils removed and be diagnosed with sleep apnea years later. That's probably the norm here. I think your mother was probably justified in her fear that your tonsils would cause you to choke to death. Okay, so that's a bit extreme. But enlarged tonsils and adenoids are the main reason for sleep apnea in children. My friend was so relieved after her children had their tonsils removed and she didn't worry about them gasping for breath every night. They could certainly go on to develop apnea later in life. Who knows?

The reality for people like me that have their tonsils is that we don't know what effect they may or may not be having. They may not have any effect. But what if they are having an effect? What if they have had an effect? As I mentioned previously, people's tonsils are supposed to shrink as they get older. Mine have not. Their size in relation to the amount of airway space in my throat is quite significant. If a traditional tonsillectomy was my only option at having them removed, I'd pass. I'd have to be having non-stop infections to consider that as an option. It's something I'm going to do more research on. I don't think there are clear cut answers, but I'd like to have more knowledge than I have now. And fortunately I have a very good doctor who will likely be receptive to any information I bring to him.

For now, I'm using the CPAP. My AHI went from 10 to .5 using the mask. Numerically, I feel like that's a victory and a very positive thing. And I need to continue working on my sleep hygiene. There are definitely other factors causing me to sleep poorly. If there was a device that would shut down one's thinking and stop the wheels of the mind from turning at the most inopportune times, I'd buy it in a hot second.

[OSAHell]

Thank you for the laugh. No offense at all. I'm trying to imagine my tonsils inside my nose and it's giving me a good giggle.
...
I think your mother was probably justified in her fear that your tonsils would cause you to choke to death. Okay, so that's a bit extreme.
...

No problem for the laugh, I had one myself, and no offence taken!

But my mother actually did notice the chocking worsening over time to the point where she started to be really afraid. It's at that moment that she took me to the ER, I never left the hospital until I got my tonsils removed few days later...

Congrats on your .5 AHI, if it keep going for a week or 2 I'm pretty sure you'll start noticing some subtile improvement.

[corvallisgrace75]

Thank you for the laugh. No offense at all. I'm trying to imagine my tonsils inside my nose and it's giving me a good giggle.
...
I think your mother was probably justified in her fear that your tonsils would cause you to choke to death. Okay, so that's a bit extreme.
...

No problem for the laugh, I had one myself, and no offence taken!

But my mother actually did notice the chocking worsening over time to the point where she started to be really afraid. It's at that moment that she took me to the ER, I never left the hospital until I got my tonsils removed few days later...

Congrats on your .5 AHI, if it keep going for a week or 2 I'm pretty sure you'll start noticing some subtile improvement.

Oh goodness! It's a good thing your mom brought you to the ER when she noticed the choking getting worse. Thanks for the congrats! Honestly, when I met with the DME therapist, he mentioned that sleep apnea can mess with your hormones. He said that women had called to thank him because they had lost 30-40 pounds. I laughed and said, "Yes, I know I could stand to lose some weight!" But if the use of the CPAP begins to subtly regulate any hormonal imbalances I may have (or rather, am sure I have) I would be thrilled. I realize that the best thing right now is to have low expectations. If I get too hopeful about "what could be", I'm only going to be let down. I'd rather be pleasantly surprised.

[tan]

... The title of the article is "Mild Obstructive Sleep Apnea Should Not Be Treated". Here's the link: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2564770/

What a retard that MD.

[Goofproof]

Thank you for the laugh. No offense at all. I'm trying to imagine my tonsils inside my nose and it's giving me a good giggle.
...
I think your mother was probably justified in her fear that your tonsils would cause you to choke to death. Okay, so that's a bit extreme.
...

No problem for the laugh, I had one myself, and no offence taken!

But my mother actually did notice the chocking worsening over time to the point where she started to be really afraid. It's at that moment that she took me to the ER, I never left the hospital until I got my tonsils removed few days later...

Congrats on your .5 AHI, if it keep going for a week or 2 I'm pretty sure you'll start noticing some subtile improvement.

Oh goodness! It's a good thing your mom brought you to the ER when she noticed the choking getting worse. Thanks for the congrats! Honestly, when I met with the DME therapist, he mentioned that sleep apnea can mess with your hormones. He said that women had called to thank him because they had lost 30-40 pounds. I laughed and said, "Yes, I know I could stand to lose some weight!" But if the use of the CPAP begins to subtly regulate any hormonal imbalances I may have (or rather, am sure I have) I would be thrilled. I realize that the best thing right now is to have low expectations. If I get too hopeful about "what could be", I'm only going to be let down. I'd rather be pleasantly surprised.

Sleep Apnea, causes everything, many years ago it caused the "Big Bang", and ingrown toenails.

[corvallisgrace75]

Thank you for the laugh. No offense at all. I'm trying to imagine my tonsils inside my nose and it's giving me a good giggle.
...
I think your mother was probably justified in her fear that your tonsils would cause you to choke to death. Okay, so that's a bit extreme.
...

No problem for the laugh, I had one myself, and no offence taken!

But my mother actually did notice the chocking worsening over time to the point where she started to be really afraid. It's at that moment that she took me to the ER, I never left the hospital until I got my tonsils removed few days later...

Congrats on your .5 AHI, if it keep going for a week or 2 I'm pretty sure you'll start noticing some subtile improvement.

Oh goodness! It's a good thing your mom brought you to the ER when she noticed the choking getting worse. Thanks for the congrats! Honestly, when I met with the DME therapist, he mentioned that sleep apnea can mess with your hormones. He said that women had called to thank him because they had lost 30-40 pounds. I laughed and said, "Yes, I know I could stand to lose some weight!" But if the use of the CPAP begins to subtly regulate any hormonal imbalances I may have (or rather, am sure I have) I would be thrilled. I realize that the best thing right now is to have low expectations. If I get too hopeful about "what could be", I'm only going to be let down. I'd rather be pleasantly surprised.

Sleep Apnea, causes everything, many years ago it caused the "Big Bang", and ingrown toenails.

LOL! I knew it caused the Big Bang! I told many others about it and they just didn't believe me. I have yet to experience the ingrown toenails...do you think it also causes my lady mustache/beard? (I'm kidding!)

[bwexler]

Sleep Apnea, causes everything, many years ago it caused the "Big Bang", and ingrown toenails.

Thank you for that info.
Now I know why I had such a problem with ingrown toe nails when I was 12. If I had known about CPAP then I could have avoided the painful visit to the doc to cut out the ingrown nail.

Who knows what other awful maladies I could have avoided through the years.

[corvallisgrace75]

... The title of the article is "Mild Obstructive Sleep Apnea Should Not Be Treated". Here's the link: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2564770/

What a retard that MD.

Care to elaborate on that, tan? I prefer to use more PC terms like "intellectually challenged", but if retard works for you, have a stab at it, good sir!

[corvallisgrace75]

Sleep Apnea, causes everything, many years ago it caused the "Big Bang", and ingrown toenails.

Thank you for that info.
Now I know why I had such a problem with ingrown toe nails when I was 12. If I had known about CPAP then I could have avoided the painful visit to the doc to cut out the ingrown nail.

Who knows what other awful maladies I could have avoided through the years.

A relief indeed, right bwexler? I'll bet you haven't had anymore ingrown toenails since using the CPAP, huh? I'm just sorry that your 12 year old self had to deal with that. LOL!

[SleepyBear83]

Grace,

Just wanted to commend you on doing your own research into what is the best therapy for YOUR situation. Too many times people get hooked on this or that without ever researching for themselves. Can CPAP be the answer to your sleep woes? Yes. Can improving your sleep hygiene be the answer? Yes. Could surgery be the answer? Yes. Could lifestyle changes such as weight loss be the answer? Yes. Could it be some combination of two or more of these options or hell even ones I don't know about? Yes!

My point is simply that you are doing the correct thing and evaluating ALL your options, ANYONE who would advise you otherwise is misguided or completely unaware. Just remember your doctor, your family, your friends, your support groups and message boards can all give you advice, stats and figures, and anecdotal evidence but only you know your body, lifestyle, and what you are capable of doing and handling.

Sleep well my friends.

[Captain_Midnight]

From Wiki... Mild OSA ... ranges from 5 to 14.9 events per hour of sleep, moderate OSA falls in the range of 15–29.9 events per hour of sleep, and severe OSA would be a patient having over 30 events per hour of sleep.

Thus, (as we all know) OSA severity is apportioned to mild, moderate, or severe at AHIs of 5, 15, and 30. One need only look at these values to conclude that the classification is wholly arbitrary. At some point in the future, investigators will observe and report frank sequellae from OSA at levels below 5, and others will repeat the study and conclusion. At some point the foolish adherence to arbitrary values will be abandoned in favor of medical research.

I'm not sure whether the current values might incorporate a safety margin to account for individuals who might be especially sensitive to OSA, and produce bad effects at lower AHI levels. Because of the arbitrary nature, I doubt it. Thus there could be a significant number of folks with OSA tested to be mild , who would benefit from xpapian therapy.

But for now, I do seen to somehow remember (IIRC) some patients have reported therapeutic value from xpap therapy, with OSA diagnosed at levels of 5 or less. (This should be confirmed, my memory is excellent, but not perfect.)

I can report this. My treated AHI averages 0.2. On rare occasion, it wanders above 1.0, and that's about AHI level at which I can sometimes feel some residual sleepiness the following morning.

But wait, there's more. Sleep study AHI is not always the same as home AHI. Your typical, home level might just be much higher than the test values.

I suspect that a large number of apneic individuals, whose titrated AHIs are mild (or low moderate), might benefit from the xpap therapy.

.

[corvallisgrace75]

Grace,

Just wanted to commend you on doing your own research into what is the best therapy for YOUR situation. Too many times people get hooked on this or that without ever researching for themselves. Can CPAP be the answer to your sleep woes? Yes. Can improving your sleep hygiene be the answer? Yes. Could surgery be the answer? Yes. Could lifestyle changes such as weight loss be the answer? Yes. Could it be some combination of two or more of these options or hell even ones I don't know about? Yes!

My point is simply that you are doing the correct thing and evaluating ALL your options, ANYONE who would advise you otherwise is misguided or completely unaware. Just remember your doctor, your family, your friends, your support groups and message boards can all give you advice, stats and figures, and anecdotal evidence but only you know your body, lifestyle, and what you are capable of doing and handling.

Sleep well my friends.

Thank you, SleepyBear83! I think you've summed up how I feel and what I've been trying to communicate in a few very nicely written paragraphs. I'm quite sure that it is a combination of at least two factors, if not more, that have contributed to my poor sleep quality. And for now, I'm going to address the ones that I feel are within my power to address-- better sleep hygiene and using the CPAP. And from there, I'll just see how it goes. I'll see my doctor in two more months and discuss things with him then. Thanks for your input.

Sleep well!

[corvallisgrace75]

From Wiki... Mild OSA ... ranges from 5 to 14.9 events per hour of sleep, moderate OSA falls in the range of 15–29.9 events per hour of sleep, and severe OSA would be a patient having over 30 events per hour of sleep.

Thus, (as we all know) OSA severity is apportioned to mild, moderate, or severe at AHIs of 5, 15, and 30. One need only look at these values to conclude that the classification is wholly arbitrary. At some point in the future, investigators will observe and report frank sequellae from OSA at levels below 5, and others will repeat the study and conclusion. At some point the foolish adherence to arbitrary values will be abandoned in favor of medical research.

I'm not sure whether the current values might incorporate a safety margin to account for individuals who might be especially sensitive to OSA, and produce bad effects at lower AHI levels. Because of the arbitrary nature, I doubt it. Thus there could be a significant number of folks with OSA tested to be mild , who would benefit from xpapian therapy.

But for now, I do seen to somehow remember (IIRC) some patients have reported therapeutic value from xpap therapy, with OSA diagnosed at levels of 5 or less. (This should be confirmed, my memory is excellent, but not perfect.)

I can report this. My treated AHI averages 0.2. On rare occasion, it wanders above 1.0, and that's about AHI level at which I can sometimes feel some residual sleepiness the following morning.

But wait, there's more. Sleep study AHI is not always the same as home AHI. Your typical, home level might just be much higher than the test values.

I suspect that a large number of apneic individuals, whose titrated AHIs are mild (or low moderate), might benefit from the xpap therapy.

.

Definitely some very good food for thought, Captain Midnight! That's fabulous that your treated value averages .2. Personally, I'm thrilled with .5. The interesting thing about my sleep study is that it was one of the worst nights of sleep I've ever had. In fact, the sleep tech led me to believe that it would need to be repeated because it took me over 3 hours to falls asleep. Far above my average of about 15 minutes. LOL! Apparently the doctor got all of the information he needed within the 3 hours in which I was asleep. And oh how cranky and miserable I was when they woke me up, mid-dream sleep, to let me know the study was over. Given how hard it was for me to fall asleep, I'm surprised that I dreamt. But I did, as I always do. I've always had very vivid dreams.

Which does make me wonder what types of results a home study would produce. Maybe it would be worse. I'm just glad that based on the results of the study, the doctor seems to have chosen an airway pressure that has allowed me to reduce my AHI from 10 to and average of .5 in the past 5 nights. My father did a home study. Poor guy. He was already a few years away from death and his health was declining. The home study demonstrated moderate apnea, which didn't surprise us given how loudly he snores. He chose to forego using a CPAP and used something called an "oxygen pillow" instead. My mom claimed that it helped. My doctor had never heard of it. But in his case, with the types of health problems he had, adding in CPAP therapy would have made things excessively complicated and frustrating for him. At my age and level of health, it is absolutely worth addressing and treating.

[Sheriff Buford]

Goof: shame on you! Global warming causes sleep apnea... along with everything else.

Sheriff