Help - newbie asks some questions

[palerider]

I am interested in CMS 50F, but the review in Amazon is not that good for the older model. The newer model doesn't seem to work with SleepyHead (based on product description in Amazon).

the review is outdated, both versions of the F work with the 0.9.8-1 version of sleepyhead, as well as the CMS 50I model.

[palerider]

Check with Palerider if he doesn't stop by here as to the compatibility of the CMS 50 F oximeter with Sleepyhead.
I think it was the older "F" that had the problem and I think that issue has been resolved but I can't swear to it. I am not quite up to snuff on each exact model. He can tell you for sure though.

the Contec folks (makers of the CMS line) completely changed (and greatly improved) the way the oximeters talk to the computer between the old and new F models.

Mark, and a guy in france and I had to work on reverse engineering the new data protocol for the new versions (I mainly just provided test data for the cms50i... mark and the guy in france did the wizard decoding stuff)... long nights on IRC running debug code and compiling changes over and over

[GoodNightRest]

#4. Yes, I have auto adjusting machine. I saw that my AHI dropped to 3 and 4. But I couldn't find the last pressure or peak pressure on the display. Any idea how can I get that info from? My machine came with SD card, but it seems that the card is empty and not recording anything. The manual doesn't help either. I use Philips SystemOne A-Flex.

I believe the machine you have listed should have detailed data. Do you mean you have Sleepyhead downloaded and are unable to see data? If so be sure the lock on the side of your SD card is in the record position (toward the insertion end).
If you do not have Sleepyhead checkout this link. https://sleep.tnet.com/resources/sleepyhead

By monitoring and posting screen shots others may be able to help you tweak your settings for better results. Here is a site that helps with that. https://sleep.tnet.com/reference/tips/imgur

Yes, I believe so too. I just checked the SD card, it is in "unlocked"/record position. When I checked the menu, it says SD card is "Free 100%"..... = empty? (I expected to see 99.x% or something less than 100%). Maybe because I haven't been able to consistently use the machine for more than 4 hours (I read about Compliance VIC in the manual). But when I turn it on, I saw card icon, and then when I turned it off, it says "data activity". I guess it's recording then. So....I guess the only way to figure out whether the card is empty or not is by plugging it in the card reader in my PC and run SleepyHead?

Thank you so much for the guidance to use SleepyHead and posting screenshots.

[OkyDoky]

Sounds like it is recording. The data files are very small and sometimes it does still say 99-100% on the card. So go ahead with the software download and see what you can see.

[GoodNightRest]

Check with Palerider if he doesn't stop by here as to the compatibility of the CMS 50 F oximeter with Sleepyhead.
I think it was the older "F" that had the problem and I think that issue has been resolved but I can't swear to it. I am not quite up to snuff on each exact model. He can tell you for sure though.

Do you have some idea what might cause the congestion?

Congestion with or without CPAP use? Without CPAP use it could very well be any number of the usual causes for nasal congestion.
With CPAP use it could simply be the drying out of the nasal mucosa. Nasal mucosa are funny little dudes...when they get irritated for any reason they swell up (or start draining) and that's what causes the congestion. Now the irritation can come from the immune system and that's when we get the typical allergy symptoms...runny nose, congestion, sneezing....all because the nasal mucosa got irritated. It also can happen when the nasal mucosa get too dry...it can also happen when the nasal mucosa get too much moisture.
Funny little dudes....they can get irritated by any number of things but what they do is the same thing no matter what makes them mad....they swell up or start running.

Google "CPAP rhinits" and start reading and you will see what I mean.

Now some people find that their nasal mucosa don't need extra moisture and they can use a cpap machine without added humidity or at a very low humidity level. There is no right or wrong when it comes to humidity choices because each person's nasal mucosa can be entirely different from the next person...heck even in the same household there can be marked differences in what makes a person's nasal mucosa happy. This is something that you will have to figure out through trial and error.

Since everyone is different what I usually tell people when they are complaining of nasal issues with cpap use...
if you aren't using a humidifier...use one
if you are using a humidifier at a low setting...try higher setting
if you are using a humidifier at an already higher setting...try lower setting
if you are using a humidifier at a middle of the road setting...toss a coin but if you find a hot shower helps your nose...go higher

My nose needs lots of moisture to be happy. It's always been that way and I joke and tell people if I could snort water it would be real happy. Others don't need so much....there is no right or wrong..there is only what works best for the individual.

Some people say that using a humidifier is entirely a "comfort" feature but I don't necessarily hold to that belief because there can be medical needs behind that "comfort" thing. There's a reason that humidifiers are now commonly dispensed with these machines..it's because research showed that most patients did better with humidifiers than without. Now there are always going to be those people who do well without added moisture but the majority of people will need at least a little added moisture.

From ResMed....
What are the overall benefits of humidification?
Up to 40% of PAP users experience nasal congestion and dryness of the nose and throat. These symptoms can be severe enough to prevent patients from continuing their treatment. The humidifier adds moisture and warmth to the air delivered by a CPAP or bilevel system. This reduces symptoms of dryness and congestion, improving patient comfort and compliance. Research also shows that nasal resistance can promote mouth breathing, which in turn leads to additional dryness. Heated humidification can prevent the large increase in nasal resistance that results in mouth breathing and leaks.

Thank you soooo much Pugsy, that's such a comprehensive explanation!
Wow, I never knew about nasal mucosa before, even though I searched up about blocked nasal passage in Google.

Yes, my case is congestion without CPAP (when I'm awake and doing regular activity). Once I use CPAP (when I'm still awake and not lying down yet) I feel I can breath better and the congestion goes away.
It sounds like nasal mucosa issue, right?

I saw Palerider is responding, I'll respond to him.

[Pugsy]

I guess it's recording then. So....I guess the only way to figure out whether the card is empty or not is by plugging it in the card reader in my PC and run SleepyHead?

The amount of data written to the SD card really doesn't take up much space and it will likely take 2 or 3 months to move much off of 100%. I think I was only at about 4% used at 6 months or so.
Use the software and you will see whatever data that is on the SD card.
The actual data files are in a sub folder of the Pserial number folder...the P0 folder is the first one to contain the data files and when that folder get full then you get a P1 folder and so on.
You have data available no matter how short the sleep session...even if you only used it for 15 minutes....it's there.

[GoodNightRest]

Sounds like it is recording. The data files are very small and sometimes it does still say 99-100% on the card. So go ahead with the software download and see what you can see.

Thanks OkyDoky, will do!

[GoodNightRest]

Check with Palerider if he doesn't stop by here as to the compatibility of the CMS 50 F oximeter with Sleepyhead.
I think it was the older "F" that had the problem and I think that issue has been resolved but I can't swear to it. I am not quite up to snuff on each exact model. He can tell you for sure though.

the Contec folks (makers of the CMS line) completely changed (and greatly improved) the way the oximeters talk to the computer between the old and new F models.

Mark, and a guy in france and I had to work on reverse engineering the new data protocol for the new versions (I mainly just provided test data for the cms50i... mark and the guy in france did the wizard decoding stuff)... long nights on IRC running debug code and compiling changes over and over

Thank you so much Palerider!
Wow, you and your team did an awesome job!

I pulled the trigger on CMS 50D+ (CMS 50F costs 4 times more).
I saw that it comes with its own software, Is it still more beneficial to use SleepyHead? More comprehensive report?
Other than timestamped, is 50F more superior (higher data sampling rate to catch Sp2 drop? better algorithm?)

I need it to measure how effective the solution I will try to improve the apnea condition (sleep elevated at 30 deg, saline spray, maybe later after reducing turbinates).
Would CMS 50D+ do it?

Thanks!

[palerider]

Wow, you and your team did an awesome job!

I pulled the trigger on CMS 50D+ (CMS 50F costs 4 times more).
I saw that it comes with its own software, Is it still more beneficial to use SleepyHead? More comprehensive report?
Other than timestamped, is 50F more superior (higher data sampling rate to catch Sp2 drop? better algorithm?)

I need it to measure how effective the solution I will try to improve the apnea condition (sleep elevated at 30 deg, saline spray, maybe later after reducing turbinates).
Would CMS 50D+ do it?

Thanks!

I was just a minor member of the team

the biggest downside of the 50d+ is that it eats batteries (about 3 nights per set of alkalines), and sometimes needs to be taped to your finger to stay on all night. the data that's reported is pretty much the same, and viewed much the same either with sleepyhead or the spo2 asst program that comes with it.

[GoodNightRest]

I guess it's recording then. So....I guess the only way to figure out whether the card is empty or not is by plugging it in the card reader in my PC and run SleepyHead?

The amount of data written to the SD card really doesn't take up much space and it will likely take 2 or 3 months to move much off of 100%. I think I was only at about 4% used at 6 months or so.
Use the software and you will see whatever data that is on the SD card.
The actual data files are in a sub folder of the Pserial number folder...the P0 folder is the first one to contain the data files and when that folder get full then you get a P1 folder and so on.
You have data available no matter how short the sleep session...even if you only used it for 15 minutes....it's there.

Thanks Pugsy, I will try it

Btw, would the machine or SleepyHead be able to detect "false positive"?
For example, when I laughed or talked while I am wearing the mask, I would imagine the machine will detect "period of strong exhales".

[Pugsy]

Btw, would the machine or SleepyHead be able to detect "false positive"?
For example, when I laughed or talked while I am wearing the mask, I would imagine the machine will detect "period of strong exhales".

SleepyHead only reports whatever data the machine gathers....SleepyHead doesn't do the flagging..the machine does.
It's the same as if you used Respironics Encore software...you would get the same flagged events.
Now the machine doesn't have a clue if you are awake or asleep. It only records pauses in breathing or reductions in breathing and it's possible to have "false positives" but they are real to the machine. Our awake breathing is much more irregular than our asleep breathing and these machines can sometimes be fooled by awake breathing...so we learn to sort of ignore stuff that shows up right at known awake times. There's some tricks we learn to try to help isolate known awake times if they are prolonged...like quickly turning the machine off and then back on again so that there is a break in the therapy line and it helps us know what we can ignore.

Take some time to read my SleepyHead tutorial (link in my signature line and also it's the top thread in the announcements section) and you will see some examples of what the software reports.

[GoodNightRest]

Wow, you and your team did an awesome job!

I pulled the trigger on CMS 50D+ (CMS 50F costs 4 times more).
I saw that it comes with its own software, Is it still more beneficial to use SleepyHead? More comprehensive report?
Other than timestamped, is 50F more superior (higher data sampling rate to catch Sp2 drop? better algorithm?)

I need it to measure how effective the solution I will try to improve the apnea condition (sleep elevated at 30 deg, saline spray, maybe later after reducing turbinates).
Would CMS 50D+ do it?

Thanks!

I was just a minor member of the team

the biggest downside of the 50d+ is that it eats batteries (about 3 nights per set of alkalines), and sometimes needs to be taped to your finger to stay on all night. the data that's reported is pretty much the same, and viewed much the same either with sleepyhead or the spo2 asst program that comes with it.

I see. I plan to use rechargeable AAA NiMH battery (800 mAh), it should work ok, right? Or do I need higher capacity?

[GoodNightRest]

Btw, would the machine or SleepyHead be able to detect "false positive"?
For example, when I laughed or talked while I am wearing the mask, I would imagine the machine will detect "period of strong exhales".

SleepyHead only reports whatever data the machine gathers....SleepyHead doesn't do the flagging..the machine does.
It's the same as if you used Respironics Encore software...you would get the same flagged events.
Now the machine doesn't have a clue if you are awake or asleep. It only records pauses in breathing or reductions in breathing and it's possible to have "false positives" but they are real to the machine. Our awake breathing is much more irregular than our asleep breathing and these machines can sometimes be fooled by awake breathing...so we learn to sort of ignore stuff that shows up right at known awake times. There's some tricks we learn to try to help isolate known awake times if they are prolonged...like quickly turning the machine off and then back on again so that there is a break in the therapy line and it helps us know what we can ignore.

Take some time to read my SleepyHead tutorial (link in my signature line and also it's the top thread in the announcements section) and you will see some examples of what the software reports.

Thank you so much Pugsy, I will check your tutorial.

Btw, do you know of any discussion thread comparing various CMS products? 50E, 50F, etc?

[GoodNightRest]

I saw two version of CMS-50F.
On the manufacturer website and Cooper Medical, the color is turquoise.
http://www.amazon.com/Useing-After-Spor ... B00LN4LCMC

But in Amazon I saw one with white color. Are they the same? Just the color is different?
http://www.amazon.com/Wrist-Color-Oxime ... B00LKUHD9K

Thanks!

[Pugsy]

There's been considerable discussion about pulse oximeters in the past but I never bothered to bookmark any of them.

I bought the CMD 50 D Plus some time ago and used it a couple of time then I loaned it to someone who needed and wanted it more than I did.
For my needs it was quite sufficient. I also used the rechargeable batteries with it but probably didn't even need to do that as I only used it twice. I knew when I bought it that I wasn't going to be using it often so I didn't see the need to get a more expensive model that had fancier options.
I found out what I suspected...no desats while on cpap therapy.

Palerider can explain the models better than I can. I just never bothered to really study up on the various features and just how important they might be to someone.
The CMS 50 D plus did all I wanted...which was to let me know if my O2 dropped. I really didn't care about time stamps or using it except rarely or storing multiple sessions or heck..even using it with Sleepyhead.
All I wanted to know was if I was having any desats while on the machine and since I wasn't there wasn't any real need to keep messing with it.
You would have to know a little more about me to understand...I just don't like stuff attached to me any more than I just have to have attached to me. I prefer minimal to none headgear...it's just the way I am. Unless there was an urgent need to do the pulse ox thing I sure wasn't going to do it and wear something else to annoy me.
Besides I am a tightwad and I saw no need to pay for features that I had a really good idea I wouldn't need or want or use.
Oh, BTW my O2 dropped to 73% during my diagnostic sleep study...so it was pretty bad but when I used my machine there was no drop.