Getting cool air

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
Old Vet

Getting cool air

Post by Old Vet » Wed Nov 19, 2014 10:41 pm

I wash my tube, mask and tub once a week an only used distilled water. I only want cold air when I sleep. I found through trial and error that filling my breather tub with distilled water midway and immediately putting it in my freezer works great! I've been doing this for over two years with no negative results.
After two tours in Viet Nam I got tired of warm, humid air and hate humidity to this day because of that experience.
So, for me, breathing cold air is wonderful and allows me to sleep quite comfortably.
I have a Resmed CPAP machine.
Good luck and I hope it works for you as well as it has for me!

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cnaumann
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Re: Getting cool air

Post by cnaumann » Wed Nov 19, 2014 10:55 pm

Do you freeze the water solid? I would be a little concerned about cracking the tub.

Interesting idea. Glad it is working for you.

mtman17
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Re: Getting cool air

Post by mtman17 » Thu Nov 20, 2014 8:40 am

My tub has never cracked and it's works great for me. As a matter of fact the VA just gave me a brand new water tub and it appears to be even more sturdier than the last one.

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englandsf
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Re: Getting cool air

Post by englandsf » Thu Nov 20, 2014 8:51 am

Tried ice in the tub but it made the humidity too low even for me. Do not use hose heat and only a little humidity during winter months seems to work for me.

Each one of us needs a different combo, no doubt

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palerider
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Re: Getting cool air

Post by palerider » Thu Nov 20, 2014 9:23 am

mtman17 wrote:My tub has never cracked and it's works great for me. As a matter of fact the VA just gave me a brand new water tub and it appears to be even more sturdier than the last one.
one wouldn't expect it to crack the tub anymore than ice cubes crack the ice cube tray.

water expands when freezing, but it'll expand upwards in a humidifier tray.

that explains why your tub's never cracked

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Re: Getting cool air

Post by Pugsy » Thu Nov 20, 2014 9:34 am

Gives a whole new meaning to my "ice cube nose" complaint...
Brrr.....
Whatever floats your boat though.

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cnaumann
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Re: Getting cool air

Post by cnaumann » Thu Nov 20, 2014 9:41 am

one wouldn't expect it to crack the tub anymore than ice cubes crack the ice cube tray.
Ice cube trays have rounded bottoms and tapered sides to eject the ice as it freezes. They are also usually made of polyethylene, not polycarbonate (or ABS or possibly something else that is clear and pretty. Clear and pretty plastics can be very strong but tend to be more brittle than cloudy ugly plastics).

And I have had a number of ice cube trays break.

I would drop in a couple of ice cubes rather than freezing water in the tub.

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palerider
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Re: Getting cool air

Post by palerider » Thu Nov 20, 2014 11:27 am

cnaumann wrote:
one wouldn't expect it to crack the tub anymore than ice cubes crack the ice cube tray.
Ice cube trays have rounded bottoms and tapered sides to eject the ice as it freezes. They are also usually made of polyethylene, not polycarbonate (or ABS or possibly something else that is clear and pretty. Clear and pretty plastics can be very strong but tend to be more brittle than cloudy ugly plastics).

And I have had a number of ice cube trays break.

I would drop in a couple of ice cubes rather than freezing water in the tub.
you're right! you will argue about anything, without any practical knowledge on the subject...

try putting water in a glass jar, fill it part way full, it doesn't have a rounded bottom (most of my ice cube trays have been flat bottomed, used to have metal flat bottom ones back in the good old days) and it doesn't have 'tapered sides'.

freeze said jar, be amazed that it didn't shatter!

if you'd like to investigate the physics of an expanding medium, .... you're welcome to do so.

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Re: Getting cool air

Post by Tatooed Lady » Thu Nov 20, 2014 7:35 pm

Quantum physics? 2(x+e=mc hammer)

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palerider
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Re: Getting cool air

Post by palerider » Thu Nov 20, 2014 7:42 pm

Tatooed Lady wrote:Quantum physics? 2(x+e=mc hammer)
*giggle*

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Re: Getting cool air

Post by TyroneShoes » Thu Nov 20, 2014 11:49 pm

palerider wrote:
cnaumann wrote:
one wouldn't expect it to crack the tub anymore than ice cubes crack the ice cube tray.
Ice cube trays have rounded bottoms and tapered sides to eject the ice as it freezes. They are also usually made of polyethylene, not polycarbonate (or ABS or possibly something else that is clear and pretty. Clear and pretty plastics can be very strong but tend to be more brittle than cloudy ugly plastics).

And I have had a number of ice cube trays break.

I would drop in a couple of ice cubes rather than freezing water in the tub.
you're right! you will argue about anything, without any practical knowledge on the subject...

try putting water in a glass jar, fill it part way full, it doesn't have a rounded bottom (most of my ice cube trays have been flat bottomed, used to have metal flat bottom ones back in the good old days) and it doesn't have 'tapered sides'.

freeze said jar, be amazed that it didn't shatter!

if you'd like to investigate the physics of an expanding medium, .... you're welcome to do so.
I think we've found a new way to make things chilly in here. Well, not new, I guess, just the same tired old method.

The Resmed (or at least my S9) tub is solid metal, and probably so that the heater pad can transfer the heat to the water better, so it might take a lot to make it crack. But I think you can also just turn the temp down, but then maybe not enough.

Still, it seems like a better approach than freezing the whole dish would be to just fill it with cubes and then pour cold water over that. Maybe not. Something to consider.

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70sSanO
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Re: Getting cool air

Post by 70sSanO » Fri Nov 21, 2014 9:23 am

I guess I'm wondering why you are using a humidifier if the purpose is to cool the air and reduce humidity. My understanding is that the primary function of a humidifier is for comfort. Although I do understand that there may also be some "medicinal" benefit of moist air going through the airway passages and also helping to keep tissues from drying out.

If the whole process includes the ice melting throughout the night so you are generating some moisture then I can see how it may make it more comfortable. Otherwise you may want to just not use a humidifier as becomes one more piece of equipment to have to deal with.

That said, if it works for you and others can benefit from it, good post!

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cnaumann
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Re: Getting cool air

Post by cnaumann » Fri Nov 21, 2014 9:54 am

try putting water in a glass jar, fill it part way full, it doesn't have a rounded bottom (most of my ice cube trays have been flat bottomed, used to have metal flat bottom ones back in the good old days) and it doesn't have 'tapered sides'.

freeze said jar, be amazed that it didn't shatter!
I tried this last night, and you are correct, the jar did not break. I really though it would. I am kind of amazed. I have pictures, but there is really no point in posting them.

However, I think you will find that most ice cube trays do in fact have sides that are tapered and at least rounded corners on the bottom, even the old metal ones.

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Re: Getting cool air

Post by palerider » Fri Nov 21, 2014 10:52 am

cnaumann wrote:
try putting water in a glass jar, fill it part way full, it doesn't have a rounded bottom (most of my ice cube trays have been flat bottomed, used to have metal flat bottom ones back in the good old days) and it doesn't have 'tapered sides'.

freeze said jar, be amazed that it didn't shatter!
I tried this last night, and you are correct, the jar did not break. I really though it would. I am kind of amazed. I have pictures, but there is really no point in posting them.
the force generated by the expanding ice goes towards the path of least resistance, and that's the air over it. the only time ice will break something when it freezes is when it has nowhere to go.
cnaumann wrote: However, I think you will find that most ice cube trays do in fact have sides that are tapered and at least rounded corners on the bottom, even the old metal ones.
that's so that the cubes come out easier, not to protect the cubes from the ice expansion. the expansion is what causes the little peaks in the middle of the cube tops.

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Re: Getting cool air

Post by cnaumann » Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:22 pm

the force generated by the expanding ice goes towards the path of least resistance, and that's the air over it. the only time ice will break something when it freezes is when it has nowhere to go.
Yes, but...

Water also reaches maximum density at about 39degrees F. This tends to cause things to freeze from the top down, since below this temperature the coldest water will move to the top. If you have an open container, it is also possible that heat transfer is greatest on the top. If the top of the water freezes first and forms a plug that sticks to the sides of the container, then when the water below freezes and expands it must either push this plug of ice up or push out on the walls of the container. If the container is brittle, it could break.

But if does not always happen. I don't normally freeze stuff in glass containers. I have been looking on the internet and apparently a lot of people do freeze stuff in glass containers and they do occasionally have breakage but it does not seem to happen often.

I know that glass containers can be broken by freezing liquids inside them. I have done it. I have broken beer bottles by leaving them in the freezer too long, even when the bottles are open. I think that beer bottles may be very susceptible to this because the narrower neck may be freezing first and the shape of the neck being tapered the wrong way prevents the ice plug from moving up.

I am somewhat tempted to put a go-pro camera in the freezer and actually watch what happens when water freezes in different shaped containers.

I have seen freezing water break all kinds of crazy stuff.